It's official: Nokia bets on Microsoft for smartphones

Nokia will adopt Windows Mobile as its main smartphone platform in a wide-ranging agreement with Microsoft. But it's not as wide-ranging as it might have been: the two giants won't formalise the relationship by forming a joint venture or spin-out, and there's no mention of exclusivity on any of the many areas touched on by the …

[cpage]

Such a pity

Nokia used to make such good phones, but they failed to modernise them, such a pity. Now they plan to join up with one of the dinosaurs of the computer industry - which seems a terrible mistake. I don't think I could bring myself to buy a Nokia phone knowing that it had Windows inside.

[Anonymous Coward]

Pregnant Pause

MS have only been having a pregnant pause, and so have Nokia. Just wait a while and their children will be born and will grow and blossom into little darlings finally. It's so exciting, I am almost wetting my knickers!

[Carol Orlowski]

Nokia R.I.P

You just did a Motorola, and killed your smartphone business. You went from a burning platform to another burning platform.

No doubt your ex-Microsoft CEO had something to do with this decision, I wonder where his priorities were...

Microsoft only look after Microsoft, they don't give a rats ass what happens to Nokia, who by the end of this will be an empty shell of their former selves. Microsoft will have gotten what they wanted out of it (WP7 not sinking without a trace) and Nokia will be scrabbling around as a bottom-feeder picking up the pieces.

I'm betting 3 years from now, they will be desperate to join OHA (if they shareholders haven't revolted by then)

This decision will be seen as the key demise of Nokia several years from now.

Congratulations Stephen Elop , your true masters back in Redmond will be most pleased.

[Jah]

Shame Nokia wasted investment in the past

Nokia killed Hildon & their Series S90 line a while ago - these today would have given fruit to competitive media devices. Symbian is a capable platform but Nokia have not managed to exploit it and therefore its all too late now. Win Phone 7 won't give Nokia a differentiation in the long term. If I were CEO, I would keep Symbian and keep developing it and dig out some of the older developers and engineers that were the visionary types that gave us S80 and S90.

[Mark Jan]

Shame Nokia Wasted Everything!

It's all just a crying shame.

Nokia could have had the world if only they had developed Symbian AND a great UI to go with it.

Instead, after that visionary collaboration with Psion, Motorola and Ericsson, Nokia pissed about for years, in the process pissing off their other partners.

Psion was just as bad, getting into bed with Motorola...

Year 2011: Remember Psion, that once great British company. Once lean and visionary, they used to produce hand helds way ahead of their time. They dared to take on (and should have won against) MS. Now they're just a MS bitch.

Year 2015: Remember Nokia, that once great global company. Once lean and visionary, they used to produce mobiles way ahead of their time. They dared to take on (and should have won against) MS. Now they're just a MS bitch.

Management consultancies being employed by incompetent committee style boardrooms who then listen to their recommendations = FAIL, FAIL, FAIL!

[John Hawkins]

Two has-beens going down together...

Their boat'll probably probably float on for for a while but I can't really see two companies with obvious bureaucracy issues improving matter by combining said bureaucracies. That they couldn't agree on exclusivity is both a sign of and a precursor to more bureaucracy. Shame really, both companies have achieved a lot over the years.

[Iggle Piggle]

Really?

I've been quite a fan of Microsoft over the years having based my career around them and their OSs. However this really smacks of desperation on the part of Nokia. A once innovative company has been reduced to making allegiances with the also ran of the smart phone world.

What a shame.

[gnufreex]

RIP Nokia

Microsoft infiltrates and destroys another great company.

[Anonymous Coward]

fixed

Microsoft infiltrates and destroys another (once) great company.

[NoOnions]

Re: RIP Nokia

Err? Nokia seemed to be doing that anyway...

[hammarbtyp]

Caveat emptor

I was working at Ericsson when a similar tie up was announced with Microsoft. That went no where, basically because the philosophies of the two companies were miles apart(i.e co-operation vs infiltrate, assimilate, destroy).

Of course things have changed a bit since then,. the ego's of both Nokia and Microsoft have taken a battering in recent years. Also with the top man in Nokia now being headed by a Microsoft man then maybe they will work together better.

However companies like Nokia are funny beasts, they are more like extensions of national culture a.k.a Finnish than multi-national companies and I can't see this going down well in the halls of Helsinki or Oulu. No wonder the CEO wants to move the head quarters to the states.

The biggest danger to Nokia is that they will become just another phone clone company, beholden to an alien operating system which they have limited control over but without the low cost base of some SE asia companies. Somehow I can't see this ending well

[GrumpyJoe]

So Nokia are now a design studio

Their product runs somebody else's OS, their product is (mostly?) made abroad, all they do is tweak and sketch.

Lovely.

[Shonko Kid]

No..

All they do is have endless re-orgs and planning meetings. That has been the problem all along. Now at least, the don't have to worry about product development eating into their precious meetings time.

[Anonymous Coward]

Design Studio...

...with a recent history of poor designs.

There was a time where I'd have bought *nothing* but a Nokia - now I'd pretty much by anything but.

For me the high point was the 6310i - every step since has been backwards and they're a long long way behind now.

I use an iPhone now, and have just bought my son an Android HTC handset. The iPhone is superb, the HTC isn't bad but neither Nokia or WP7 even figured on my "ones to consider" list. :-(

[Christian R. Conrad]

Almost perfectly correct

Except the highpoint was either the 6310 or even more probably the 6210, in both cases without the 'i'.

[DrXym]

Somebody else's OS is better than their own

Problem with Nokia is the left hand doesn't appear to know or care what the right hand is doing. They've got mouldy old Symbian chugging along in one range of handsets while they have modern but doomed-to-fail Meego on the other.

Neither is going to work for Nokia, and Windows Phone is a superior OS. On the other hand, Nokia is now in the same boat as HTC & Samsung churning out generic WP7 phones. They're Microsoft's bitch jumping to the user experience and specifications that MS dictate. Where is the brand identity in that strategy? Where is the money in that strategy when HTC & Samsung probably have lower cost bases?

I seriously think if Nokia were to partner up with anyone it should have been HP. Failing that, go with Android where the the OS acts more as a framework to hang their own identity and they have enormous latitude to do whatever they like in software and hardware.

[Richard Willetts]

HP not an option?

They bought Palm, You really think they want to take that and fragment it by adding a third name to the list? HP|Palm|Nokia?? I don't think so!

This is the best move they could have made, Nokia was historically a favorite because of user experience and ease of use, that kindof got lost as phones got smarter and more and more features were desired by customers, Windows Phone 7 enables them to go back to their roots, remember the NaviKey? The WinPho7 interface is simplicity itself and a joy to use, I am a little tempted by the Pre3 but I have BTDT with the Pre and it doesn't look different enough to warrant me going back from a platform I really like!

Tried android, wasn't keen, even with HTC Sense, and I have NEVER like iOS so this move is music to my ears, at least gives me hope that my next phone can be a WinPho7 one too!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: So Nokia are now a design studio

I'm afraid so, GrumpyJoe.

I still have my old 6670, with "Made in Finland" printed on it. My best smartphone ever, I think.

Daniel

[Kurgan]

Extra-Super-Duper-Mega FAIL!

Uhm... Symbian, then Maemo and also Symbian, then they said "no more Symbian", then a single Maemo phone, then more Symbian, then Meego (the "Duke Nukem Forever" of phone operating systems) , and now Win7?

I spy, with my little eye, something beginning with F. **CAPITAL FAIL**

So now we have the two losers of the phone market, one of which has been the leader for years, that think that joining their forces they can fly again. I bet they will simply sink faster.

Even if my icon does not show a coat, mine is the one with a new Android phone in the pocket.

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh dear!

This needs 2 Fail! icons.

Nokia: too many handsets, too little development of Symbian

MS: Struggling since Windows CE to produce a decent mobile OS. 14 years and its still not right!

Fail, meet Fail.

[mafoo]

or..

"Operation 'Trojan Horse' complete Mr Ballmer. When do i return to the mothership?"

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not a joke.

Or if it is, not the usual funny kind. Though I'd be surprised if anyone expected it would be.

I don't really have much to say on this; I've said most of it in the oversized comment in the last episode.

I really don't see how running back to the roost is to be visionary. Yes, nokia is pretty much aflame. But these aren't the doings of a decisive crisis manager. It's not salvaging what you have and kicking out the rot. It's a panicked knee-jerk and I don't think nokia will reap much from this. It's more of a placeholder kind of deal, but not one that does anything for nokia brand loyalty. At all.

Ballmer is happy because he just got promised some 50 million handsets.

And Elop? He's happy he can shake Ballmer's hand "as an equal".

I would've expected a shakeup in the UI/UX department, and, hm, the phone design dept. could use some refocusing too. It's not happening. What also isn't happening is a shakeup of the superstructure that caused nokia to mostly wage inter-department wars on each other, instead of doing what they used to be good at, before the restructuring.

Yet MeeGo (I've always thought that sounded suspiciously as if written with a T in there) gets to experience yet another leadership shakeup; I recall seeing a lot of job adverts for senior management and architecture positions in that division. Well, that didn't last long.

The irony of open sourcing meego on the heels of failing to open then closing symbian again -- to use it as a "licencing organisation" milking cow AFTER every other user of the system has bailed, wonderful timing that -- doesn't fill me with confidence.

If the nokians (not counting the brass) have any sense, they'll plaster Qt over wp7 as fast as can be, do all of the UI/UX stuff on that, then fix either or both of symbian and meego to run really really well under Qt, and basically make wp7 obsolete. I'm saying that as someone who loathes Qt because it's so big and bloated to compile on a desktop; it just means it's more work, but right now the only way out of the three OSes, no UX conundrum they're stuck in.

They can do that, but they'll have to pull a "two engineers in a corner" type trick. Like unix' early days, or even the heroics of the pacific tech graphing calculator. The people who have to do it don't get paid enough for it, as the people who do get paid enough aren't doing it.

So why would they? I don't see it. In fact, as pointed out here (sendo) it's much more likely nokia will cease to be this way or that way, with some juicy morsels ending up in redmond somehow. They're as destructive as yesteryear's pension funds, only differently so. I much sooner expect an exodus.

[Anonymous Coward]

What are you on about?

Go away troll. Nokia’s distribution will make Windows Phone 7 a top 3 platform. Also Nokia diversifies with WP7 as an OS. It's a win-win.

[hyartep]

no diversification

nokia killed symbian&meego. how can this be called diversification?

[Anonymous Coward]

@hyartep

It can because Nokia was going down the drain with Symbian and Meego. Simples.

[Anonymous Coward]

Down the drain?

In 2009 Nokia sold 67 million smartphones, in 2010 they sold over 100 million. Apple sold an additional 25 million from 2009 to 2010. It sure seems like Nokia was holding their own, their increase was higher than Apple. Q2 to Q3, Apple had 24.3 and 25% of the US market share, they pretty much peaked. After a few quarters with Verizon, they will be back to their peak again. Nokia could have held onto the #2 spot with ease, but not now with WP7 and that Symbian is gone. Who would even buy a Symbian powered device unless they got it for free with a contract?

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: @hyartep

"It can because Nokia was going down the drain with Symbian and Meego."

Do you even know what diversification means?

"Simples."

Evidently not.

[Anonymous Coward]

Bad Idea

Palm's failure is precisely why Nokia shouldn't have gone down this route. This is infinitely stupid and Elop should be fired before this has a chance to break Nokia!

[Anonymous Coward]

Apples and Oranges

Palm was failing quite a long time before the switched their MS to Windows.

Unfortunately they switched to MS too late in my view, coupled with the fact that MS were not innovating enough with Win Mobile after an initial push. But it is different now and Win Mobile is a great OS, with an easy as pie interface for the dumbed down masses in our society whilst still having enough play and tweak in the engine room for the rest of us.

Also Nokia has failed badly with their software development. I have used both the E71 and E72 after coming off Win 6.1 and athough the handset is great the OS is cr@p and buggy and the sync with the new Ovi software permanently sucks 50% CPU and still they refuse to fix it for over y year.

Bottom line is that two negatives will make a positive in this case.

[Anonymous Coward]

Try again

It took 7 weeks for 1.5 million WP7 handsets to be sold. With those numbers, they will sell 11 million handsets in 2011. Nokia sold 100 million smartphones in 2010; mostly running Symbian (Maemo is included in these numbers.) That means every week they sell over 13 million Symbian powered smartphones. That is more than WP7 will sell in all of 2011 at their current numbers. So Nokia goes from 100 million to battling for a piece of 11 million.

Investors are not happy with this announcement. When this fails, Elop will be known as Elop. I have a feeling that MeeGo is being kept as a backup plan. I have used Symbian phone exclusively for the past decade, the N8 will be my last and will migrate to Android. So the very thing that Elop is trying to compete with, his actions have caused me to defect. Great business plan there, alienate the current 100 million + customers you have.

I wonder when the investors will demand his ouster?

[Mr-Kandid]

Unhand the pipe!

You are a crack smoker. What lazy thinking. This turns a once amazing company like Nokia, renown for it's research, into just another commoditised hardware play. Cowardice, fear and a long drink of Koolaid have now placed Nokia 3 to 5 years behind and possibly cemented their future in all Business School Use case studies. someone has spent too much time worshipping Redmond.

[Anonymous Coward]

New Icon

Can you replace "REG" on the gravestone with NOKIA ?

Of course, this might not be necessary if Microsoft can provide funding for Nokia until 2013 - about the time when they will have a stable processor (hence energy) efficient OS for smartphones...

[DrStrangeLug]

Should have been android

Seriously, is it some mark of status in the IT world to regard Google as your competitor ?

I think Nokia hardware is great, let down by their OS. An android N97 would be fantastic. But no, "Google is our competitor." says Nokia. Rubbish. HTC, Samsung, LG, Sony - they're the competition.

This will turn into a coalition of losers.

[Anonymous Coward]

Hmm...

Odd decision as this is (and I'm a former life-long Nokia user who has defected to Winphone) but why would they go to Android? Particularly when it's a giant lawsuit about to explode in Google's face.

[Shonko Kid]

"let down by their OS"

No, it wasn't their OS that let them down, it was their lack of focus on UX and that has let them down. Far too concerned with transitioning to an 'internet services company'. Whatever the hell one of those is. Rampant complacency, silo mentality, and lack of a single coherent vision is where the problem lies.

"An android N97 would be fantastic" You think Android would've run any better on the N97 HW? It's some way short of even the now antique G1

[whiteafrican]

The trouble with Nokia making Android phones...

...is that Smasung and HTC have been in that game a lot longer, and have an established user-base. For Nokia to compete against HTC and Smasung on their home turf would be economic suicide. WP7, on the other hand, is only a couple of months old (and already has a larger marketplace than Android had at this point in its own development). No manufacturer has a particularly well-established user base yet, so Nokia has a really good opportunity to make its own mark.

From Nokia's perspective, it makes sense to pick the OS ecosystem that they can best compete in - and Android simply isn't it; not because of any failings in Android, but because there are too many players who are too well established in the Android ecosystem.

[Andy Jones]

Won't happen

Stephen Elop is still on Microsofts payroll. It was inevitable that he would steer Nokia into Microsofts arms! All I can say is 'Bye bye Nokia. Was nice knowing you!'.

Microsoft will either eventually buy them or destroy them and then buy them! Or maybe just destroy them because it won't be the first time they have written into the contract that if the partner goes bust all their IP belongs to Microsoft (Sendo anyone?).

[DrXym]

The funny part

Is why Nokia perceived Android as the enemy. They could have taken the source and moulded it in their own image. They could have skinned it to look Symbian-ish for ease of migration, they could have made Ovi pervasive through all the whole experience, they could have made handsets in any way, shape or form they cared,

By chumming up with Microsoft now they just become one more provider of virtually identical handsets. I'm sure the OS allows moderate customization but nothing like the cart blanche they had at their disposal. I think the partnership will result in a serious loss of identity for Nokia which is probably not the best thing to be contemplating for a company that relies on it so much.

[Bram]

Wow - short sighted

Android is a competitor, open source and free doesnt mean that there isnt any drawbacks. All it would take is a new CEo at google or a major court ruling that would mean Google have to find revenue elsewhere and then there is a lot of people who would have tied their lively hoods to them. The only likely survior would be HTC who have diversified their portfolio.

This is very similar to the rise of China, they make cheap items which everyone can benefit from and a lot of countries have banked their businesses on getting manufacturing done there. Now China have got them by balls and very soon (with all the new international Chinese students studying around the world) they will learn from their 'competitors' and eventually cut them out. Do their own R&D and design (Nexus One).

Im not saying don't use Android, I'm just saying don't act they are the holy grail

[Bram]

Market Differentiation

If they use Android, it is harder to differentiate their product from the rest, their brand also becomes dialuted. Thats why they attempted to produce their own OS, which is not easy despite what all the techies on The Reg seem to believe.

Nokia using Windows Phone is a way for them to sell Smart Phones in the growing smart phone market and be competitive in the long run Meego/symbian might pull something magical out (the next phase). Where Nokia hjas been strongest is in mobile phone sales and that's why they have decided to separate the business into two sections.

It is quite a savvy business strategy move which may pay off, if it doesnt then they can just dissolve that half of the business and it will have little impact on its stronger section the mobile phone one.

[/\/\j17]

Good News For Me!

This is great news for me...no point me waiting to see if the MeeGo N9 actually gets announced as a Communicator replacement (yes, I'm still using my 4 year-old E90) I can just wait for the E7 to come out and compare it with the HTC Desire Z, the only other Communicator-like device on the market!

[Conrad Longmore]

E90

I too gave up waiting for a decent replacement for my E90 and bought a Motorola Milestone instead. And I'm certainly not the only ex-Symbian user to move that way...

[Anton Ivanov]

After this announcement I think I am going to join you

I will probably keep my current E71 as an "embedded SAT NAV".

However, for proper phone use it looks like I will be surrendering to the inevitable "Have a no, but yes, but no "Little Britain Java (TM)" phone. Probably from the company which already got burned on one MSFT alliance once upon a time - Sony/Ericson.

R.I.P. for a once great European company which was showing to the world that it is possible to do great stuff even if your employees are on a "lifetime, I will never get fired" payroll.

It is a pity the consultants which have designed its current management structure, current innovation (or lack of) strategy, current HR and performance management to support it will not be the ones to foot the bill for this. It is also a given that the many "declining market share once-been" blue chips which have taken the advice of the same consulting shops will not take any lessons from this either.

Sigh... While expected and anticipated this is an utterly depressing day...

[zanto]

bought a milestone for the missus

now it's either the dezireZ or milestone2 that i'm considering to replace my 6 year old 9300.

as a long time nokia user, i'm disgusted.

the n900 will remain the "smartest" phone that nokia ever built.

[petur]

R.I.P. Qt

One day telling devs this is the one framework you need, next day it's in the thrash...

You can only hope Meego with Qt and FOSS behind it can come up with a good platform, but you need a big company and a whole ecosystem behind it.

FAIL it is :/

[/\/\j17]

Qt still alive - though why would you use it now?

Forum Nokia has a letter to developers about the future of Qt...

"Qt will continue to be the development framework for Symbian and Nokia will use Symbian for further devices; continuing to develop strategic applications in Qt for Symbian platform and encouraging application developers to do the same."

"Extending the scope of Qt further will be our first MeeGo-related open source device, which we plan to ship later this year."

So Nokia's single, unified development platform that means developers only need to write once for all Nokia/other adopter phones...means just the low-end Symbian and probably a single MeeGo iPad clone (followed by a swift death for MeeGo).

And this will make people adopt Qt because...?

[Anton Ivanov]

Zombie framework on a zombie OS...

Fantastic idea...

Unless it is picked up by one of the many companies which have their business strategy built around webkit and qt-embedded this means that it needs a RIP stone as well.

[Sander van der Wal]

Qt is dead

... on Symbian, because Symbian is moving to that segment of the market where people do not or cannot spend money on phone hardware. How much money are these people going to spend on software?

... on MeeGo because MeeGo is dead

... and on all other platforms too because Qt is now not essential anymore to Nokia's core business. Nokia will keep paying for Open Source software on PC platforms?

... and because it now cannot make the transition to mobile.

Qt is dead.

[DrXym]

QT isn't dead

QT still has uses on the desktop and in embedded solutions and will likely still earn Nokia money. It still represents the best and easiest way to develop cross platform applications in C++ for example.

There is no doubt however that jumping in bed with MS is a kick in the balls. Not just to QT, but MeeGo and Symbian. And to Nokia's self respect and identity.

[Anonymous Coward]

"Qt isn't dead"

Well I reckon it is.

If you were an actual or possible Qt user, how is this move anything but bad news for Qt?

Where I work was a possible Qt user . Till a few weeks ago, my employer had been certified MS dependent. A change of management has reconnected them to the real world, and Qt had been on the list of "what should we do for a GUI" instead of being certified Microsoft dependent.

Now Qt is likely off the list. The reason should be obvious. As far as Microsoft are concerned, "business partner" = "organ donor".

[jotheberlock]

On the other hand

There is also an experimental Qt port for Android...

If Google have any sense, they'll support Qt on Android officially. That way they have a hedge against the Java lawsuits.

[David Garnier]

Stockmarket reaction

As I speak, on the Euronext Nokia is down about 9% and Microsoft up 3%, which is what anyone would expect: Nokia finally admitting defeat and Microsoft's mobile division getting supercharged.

[chr0m4t1c]

I wonder where we go from here.

I hadn't realised that Elop was a former MS man; that rather rendered earlier speculation moot; if he had left under a cloud they would have gone with Android, otherwise it would be WM7.

I wonder if this is a new MS strategy to take over the world, by getting ex-MS (but friendly) people into senior positions in other companies.

I also wonder if the current crop of flagship models will get WM7 instead of Symbian^4 or if Nokia will take their usual route of pretending they never made them and just stopping all updates.

Here's a clue Nokia: One of the reasons that knowledgeable users are switching to Android and iOS is because they can be sure that there will be newer version of the OS and there's a reasonable chance they will be able to put it on their phone if it's less than two years old. That kind of thing leads to recommendations to others

[Cosmo]

In the words of Vader

Nooooooooooooooo! Oh Nokia, what have you done by getting into bed with Microsoft. Android was the way to go. RIP-

[RichyS]

Cheerio Nokia

Oh well, I guess Nokia had a few good years.

It was nice knowing you...

[GregC]

'Bye then Nokia

Shame. I love my N900, and my N770 and 800 before it, but it looks like it will be my last Nokia phone - unless they actually, ever, ship the N9 with Meego.

So I'm left with no choice but Android for my next phone I guess. How depressing.

[BorkedAgain]

Cheer up Greg...

It's actually quite good.

In fact, pretty much everyone who's asked me to give 'em a quick demo has gone away wanting one. Including some iPhone4 users, and at least one person with a Nokia handset ruining the line of his suit.

Isn't that encouraging? Come... Join us...

[envmod]

and you guys laughed

at me when i predicted (last year) the end of Nokia within 5 years....just watch this space.

[Anonymous Coward]

How is it possible for Nokia to be so crap at software?

After years of making all the wrong decisions with Symbian (S80 was good for it's time so of course they only ever used it on one 'phone) they're now moving to Windows. Are they insane?

Of course they've got history, almost all their 'phones require proprietary Windows based software to sync, backup and update. Said Windows software was far worse than their 'phone software which bodes reeeaaaalllly well.

Also, Orlowski comment! Woooo! (Normally such remarks get a good moderating but it's Friday, I'm in the mood!)

[Schultz]

Possible success

To be the lone contrarian here, let me predict SUCCESS!

They just have to create the 30$ Winphone with bells and whistles to show the world that there are cheap, powerful alternatives to the fancy Apple and Andorid offerings. Ooh, and those phones should appear within the year.

Let's see that multibillion-dollar war-chest again, and let's see it committed to a brighter world with lots of windows!

[Sarah Bee]

Re: Possible success

Shill! Shill! It's the only possible explanation for your opinion! Show us the cheque! Shiiiiillll! etc

[Peter Gathercole]

My word. What a reaction!

Sarah. While I don't disagree with your statement, your reaction seems a bit extreme.

I know that you never claim to be without any bias, but you normally leave it to us to be quite so loud. Does this post infringe house rules 7 or 9? I would hate to see the moderator banned from the forum!

Ah. Maybe you left the screen lock off when you went for coffee or something, and it was not Sarah who wrote this!

[Sarah Bee]

Re: My word. What a reaction!

I'm sorry, I clearly wasn't sarcastic enough. I was being sarcastic. You know, because whenever anyone says anything favourable about a company here they are always mindlessly accused of being paid to say it.

Sigh.

[James Hughes 1]

@Sarah

You would have to be blind and stupid not to release that was sarcasm. So, Sarah, you are alright.

[Peter Gathercole]

@James Hughes 1

I like to think that the moderator team enjoy us playing word games with them sometimes. I really was trying to be humorous myself, but maybe I was too subtle for some people.

If I manage to elicit a direct response from one of them once in a blue moon, then that makes all the comments I write worthwhile.

[Sarah Bee]

Re: @James Hughes 1

Oh. I didn't get it. Hey ho. Glad to be of... something.

[Anonymous Coward]

Not in Nokia's lifetime

The royalty on WP7 alone is $55. So no cheap phones.

Nokia is now a terminal patient, just waiting for the inevitable end.

Redundancy announcements to follow.. we only need 50 people.

[Anonymous Coward]

$55 royalty??

$55 royalty was for CE. Windows Mobile was $8 - $15. WP7 probably less.

And don't forget that HTC pays Microsoft a royalty to use Android.

[Richard Barnes]

Re: Possible Success

How will they be able to create a $30 Winphone when MS are going to demand that or more per phone in licence fees for the OS?

[Anonymous Coward]

"...and those phones should appear within the year."

Ah.

[BorkedAgain]

Cheap, powerful alternatives...

...to the fancy Apple and Android offerings already exist. Some of the best run Android, mind, but they're not expensive. The Orange San Francisco, for example, is extremely capable, costs under a ton and can be unlocked for free.

Okay, it's not $30, but it does have the distinct advantage of actually existing...

[Anonymous Coward]

RIP Nokia

What a pity. I've always liked Nokia phones, but I think this will swing me to Android when I need to replace the current one.

[Mahou Saru]

MS - Masters of Stealth

Can't win with the tech, ninja them and force them to use WM7. I wonder what will happen with the low end phone market? They do say WM7 for smartphone, so I guess that leaves Symbian for low end and MeeGo out of the door with Torres....

[Anonymous Coward]

Odd one out

Well I must be the only one but I don't mind the sound of a Nokia running WP7.

[hplasm]

How does that sound?

Like a grinding noise- or is that the user's teeth?

[Richard 116]

Why?

What's your Nokia running WP7 like? Is it bad?

[Anonymous Coward]

Looking at WP7 marketshare

yes I think you are the only one....

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't use certain kit because everyone else does

Happy to be the only one, I will use what I find best for my needs, not scuttle for cover and protection in crowds. I also don't judge on what is suitable for my needs by marketshare.

[James 47]

No Android because...

Nokia need to figure out a way to make money from Navteq, which cost them billions to buy. If they went Android they'd be tied to Google Maps.

[Anonymous Coward]

ok

And they knew they were just too shit at sw to ever get meego to fly? Maybe, maybe.

I guess writing off the investment in Qt is easier for them to stomach - for the same reason perhaps

[simpfeld]

Not really

You are free to customise on Android (unlike WM7). Just have to make sure Navteq is better that Google Maps and people will use it.

[Anonymous Coward]

Thats tosh

You can use Android without having to use Googles services.

[Matt Bucknall]

Goodbye Nokia...

Hello HTC.

[Anonymous Coward]

Should Have Gone Android

At least in the short term until Meego was completed.

Nokia, welcome to the world of dull MS where your WP7 phones will have all the imagination and design flair of Steve Ballmer's wardrobe.

I wonder what's going to happen to Qt ?

[fishyuk]

Great news, will help both a lot.

Rather unfashionable for the Reg it seems but WP7 is a fantastic OS. Whilst upgrading my HD2 from the POS that is WP6.5 to Android has been great for me it still feels old, clunky and fugly compared to my WP7 Optimus.

Looking forward to some nice hardware from Nokia and glad that increased visibility will help even more apps appear on the platform.

Also really pleased that the usual MS haters are so put out, fantastic.

[fiddley]

Agreed!

I can confidently predict most people here haven't even tried the ting... I've got a Samsung Omnia 7, Galaxy S and I've been trialling an N8 recently.

Windows phone 7 dumps on android & nokia from some considerable altitude.

I lost my WP7 last weekend and during the wait to get a replacement using the galaxy S was probably less fun than having my eyes sucked out with a Dyson. MS are off to a steady rather than spectacular start but once this thing gains traction, I predict it's going to be a juggernaut, the great unwashed will lap it up. It's a brilliant piece of kit and I love it (v1.0 too)!! I also love the fact that no-one's seen one before, so you get people coming over to take a look like they did when no-one had an iPhone. So it makes me feel popular ;)

[Anonymous Coward]

*Bless* your heart!

...so cute!

[Anonymous Coward]

Best subheading ever

Losers Alliance? Love it.

[Fuzz]

wow not much hope on this forum

personally I'm looking forward to a Nokia with the camera from the N8 but a decent OS. Also this sounds like Windows Phone will get turn by turn satnav which is the main thing holding me back from buying one.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yup...

It's mighty powerful Register-Commentard groupthink going on today.

I personally own a WinPhone 7, not because I'm an MS shill, but because I like it. It has faults sure, and proper sat nav will be nice but it's actually got a very nice well thought out UI.

I hardly think this is the end of Nokia or MS trying to infiltrate and extinguish them.

[Anonymous Coward]

Clearly in the minority here

But my thought was that a phone with the build quality of the top end Nokias running Mobile 7 would actually be pretty damn sweet.

[Anonymous Coward]

RIP indeed

Not really surprised but still shocked. LIke 1st poster said this really needs two fail icons. Bye bye Nokia, you were actually a good company for a while. Why did you ever take up this snake Elop we'll never understand.

Just hope they spin off their bit from Nokia Siemens Networks, wouldn't wish to let Microsoft get into the hard core networking side too, that would put back the whole industry, and please leave your grubby hands off Qt too.

[bob's hamster]

Interesting Times

Desperation? Maybe, but the new Windows phones are very good. Personally I hope this gives them a bit of a spurt so that the market isn't 80% android in a couple of years. Apple? Well, they will trade market share for maintaining margin on products like in the late 80s, early 90s with their Mac II, SE, SE30 etc.

[Leona A]

No surprise

This is of no surprise really is it? Come on Ex M$ bod joins Nokia, what do you think he's going to do? There is only one thing he knows, people don't like change or stepping out of their comfort zone, so he takes the company in a direct he knows best.

I was so hoping that Nokia would be brave enough to do something different, step outside the box, develop something for the enlightened people of the world, but sadly this is not going to be the case. I probably makes sense to Nokia, make phones for the masses and clones out there, if I wanted to be a clone, I'd have bought an Iphone, I want freedom, expression and the right to do what I want, now there is nothing that embraces that, they say they will develop Meego, but that'll disappear soon for sure, Sad Times :'(

[dagger]

RIP Nokia

Nokia has made many bad decisions in the past. But this one beats everything.

I loved Nokia and I'm devastated seeing it practically dead.

[Shonko Kid]

Which one looks happiest?

Well, if it turns out that Nokia are paying for WinPhone7, ever, then Ballmer has a right to grin, it could've just bought him a couple more years of chair throwing in Redmond.

[Charles Calthrop]

for some reason this makes me very sad

mega corp 4 screwed by mega corp 2, dunno why that is upsetting but it is, oh Nokia!

[EtonBears]

I haven't stopped laughing yet...

Images of 2 drunks propping each other up or 2 dinosaurs looking anxiously at the skies come to mind!

Nokia's problems stem from being unable to bring to market good engineering and design ideas with sufficient speed, neither of which will be significantly helped by trying to use Windows.

Micosoft's problems stem from having built a paranoid, inward-looking software empire that produces mediocre products slowly and fosters developer interest through fear rather than enthusiasm. Their prospects may be marginally improved by this announcement, but as long as they are unable to change their corporate culture ( leap off THEIR burning platform, if you will ), they will continue to be an also-ran in new makets.

I thought Meego had been too long in gestation to garner much support, but at least it was a move in sync with the general trend towards *nix based and open development models; looking backwards towards Microsoft seems poor judgement.

From a developer point of view, I want to construct my toolset around what makes most sense to me, picking and choosing what is best for my requirements. Both Symbian and Windows ( for different reasons ) make this difficult, and therefore are unattractive.

From a user point of view, I want a wide selection of different device experiences to choose from. Most people grow up with rapidly-changing technology now, and are quite able to learn any interface that is put in front of them.

From this point of view, Android has it right in that the underlying platform is a consistent ecosystem, but the interface can reflect the needs of the device it is running on, or the market the device is aimed at. Windows Mobile, on the other hand. has just returned to the Microsoft dark ages of preventing differentiation and providing a one-size-fits-nobody experience. No thanks.

Nokia probably should have chosen to go with some combination of Meego, Android and maybe even talked to Mark Shuttleworth at Canonical ( Ubuntu ) for their software needs, whilst getting their head round the challenge of resolving their design and engineering problems.

When it comes down to it though, Nokia are a big company that want control ( look at how their behaviour destroyed the promise of Symbian ) and Microsoft are a big company that want control. There will be tears before bedtime...

[Andus McCoatover]

Ohhh...This is BAD!!! Worse than expected.

It couldn't be worse, IMHO.

So, probably I guess, I'll have to accept a download^Wdowngrade on my new, shiny Nokia N8 to Windows Phone. If that happens, they cane have the bloody thing back, as it's not what I signed my 2-year contract for.

I signed it for both the hardware AND the software/OS.

"• Nokia’s content and application store will be integrated with Microsoft Marketplace for a more compelling consumer experience." End of OVI. Embrace, Extend, Extinguish. See no mention of the trademarked word "OVI" (door) in the Open Letter. However, I DO see "Bing", and "adCenter" - both Microsoft trademarks - in the statement. Interesting - the guys at Ovi must be crapping themselves.

One thing the statement made that I totally agree with:

"We each bring incredible assets to the table." Webster's "Incredible: too extraordinary and improbable to be believed."

I guess from Websters, one can also use "compelling" as : 'demanding attention'. That'll be Symbian, then.

Mary and Niklaus keep their jobs. This week.

Phew, what a day!!

[Anonymous Coward]

You are safe

WinPho7 won't run on an N8, it doesn't have the horsepower. Symbian is fine, WP7 not so. Will also take at least a year to get any WP7 phones out of Nokia, and that new models, not upgrades to existing phones. Doubt they will even bother with WP7 upgrades to their existing range.

[Anonymous Coward]

@Andus

Please stay where you are, I've called the hyperbole police and they'll be with you shortly.

Couldn't be worse, my arse.

[DrXym]

Heh

And only yesterday I was speculating HP and Nokia should partner up. Nokia's phone OS strategy is abysmal.

I suppose Windows Phone 7 is better than what they have but is it a sound long term strategy? Every damned WP7 phone is virtually interchangeable. Same form factor, virtually the same specs, virtually the same user experience. Nokia might gain a boost by going to WP7 but now Nokia is competing with 4 or 5 substantially identical other models. So what reason will anyone have for buying a Nokia phone over (for example) an HTC or Samsung phone?

I think they would have been better off with HP really, assuming HP had the sense to realise they need a major partner.

For all the talk that Android is fragmented, it does at least allow a variety of models at all price points with some corporate personality in them. WP7 really needs to offer the same.

[Anonymous Coward]

photo

Have you ever seen a better pair of smug, potato-faced, self-serving cretins?

[Anonymous Coward]

Cretins they're not

Just ask Elop's Swiss Bank account manager. He'll confirm: the guy is a genius who got rich real quick.

[Steve Evans]

"We are standing on a burning deck..."

and now you've just poured petrol over yourself.

[Anonymous Coward]

Friends indeed

At least they'll be able to console each other as they trudge down the long, painful road to "rounding error" market share. Personally I think Nokia have just signed their death warrant.

[Anonymous Coward]

Another FAIL vote

and we're talking biblical epic level FAIL here. I've been a loyal Nokia feature phone user for the best part of 12 years, the one digression onto another brand (Samsung) still makes me shudder to remember. I've been fighting the smart phone seduction for some time but this unholy alliance of the desperate pretty much makes sure that it'll be android for me if I do. Probably once my 6500 Classic finally dies.

[penguin slapper]

Hotel Microsoft

Microsoft man joins BBC - BBC provide acres of free advertising for Windows.

Microsoft man joins Nokia - Nokia choose Windows for new phones.

You can check out any time you like but you can never leave.

[Anonymous Coward]

and...

...Microsoft man becomes VC of the Open University now known as the "Open" University

[Colin Brett]

Great shame

I've been happy with Nokia phones for years. It now looks like the one in my pocket will be the last Nokia device I'll ever buy. Time to start checking on good deals for Android phones.

[simpfeld]

I don't get it

So you are basically ditching your own OS's and your problem is dropping handset sales. Why take a risk with an unproven platform.

Why not just be OS agnostic? Do Android and WM7 phones!

I can see lots in this for MS and just risks for Nokia.

[Jay 2]

RIP Nokia

If I recall correctly, in using WinPho7 you can't do anything to the GUI (like HTC throwing something over Android). So as stated above, Nokia become just another handset maker. Based on that, I don't really see what Nokia are getting out of this.

MS on the other hand might be a bit happier with being able to flog more WinPho7 and maybe get a bit more market share. Though in the long run, will that be enough for WinPho to compete with iOS and Android?

[Anonymous Coward]

$0.02 worth

Like many others I have a lot of respect for nokia hw but wont buy any more with windows running on it, just my personal choice. Think its a shame that meego is almost certainly dead- not enough community momentum and intel knows when it is beat. Qt stands more chance, hope it makes it.

No JV or similar? avoids anti-trust or maybe microsoft just doesn't need it - nokia is their bitch now and everyone knows it.

[Anonymous Coward]

Told you so ...

When NOKIA made a total mess of releasing and supporting what could have been their lever to open up the smartphone market, the N900, I and many others predicted that their inability to identify the differences between their posterior and their middle arm joint might indicate trouble ahead. Sadly they've now launched a rickety lifeboat (from the burning platform) into shark infested waters (with frickin lasers on their heads).

Meanwhile I'm looking at the N900 in front of me and weeping for what might have been ...

[SMFSubtlety]

Nokia Tyres

I look forward to putting Nokia Tyres on my car in 5 years time

[Anonymous Coward]

Re: Nokia Tyres

Except they don't even own that business any more.

[Nick_Healey]

They haven't fixed *why* their UX is so bad

AFAICT Nokia are keeping their options open - they didn't kill Symbian or Meego (or Qt).

But since their bureaucracy stopped them creating a simple friendly UX on Symbian, over TEN years - when ten people could do that in six months, say - I don't expect their Win7 phones will be up to much. ('Successful UX *is* the end product, BTW...)

@Jah, even if Nokia got their EPOC/Series90 designers back, I fear they'd get nowhere in that bureaucracy. Nokia do have lots of talented designers still, but an insane development process / bureaucracy stifles them, AIUI. And that's something Nokia haven't fixed here. :-(

[Anonymous Coward]

Is this safe?

No, not interested in phone security issues due to MS. Neither am I in this co-operation. What I do wonder is whether it's advisable for Elop to shake hands with a dancing monkey. I for my part avoid situations in which I come too close to apes without heavy bars in between.

[BorkedAgain]

Ew.

I hope he wasn't shaking his shit-throwing hand...

[FordPrefect]

Writing is on the wall...

It really is a shame that its come to this but I guess with an ex-MS man in charge of Nokia it was always going to happen, I wonder what would have happened if it had been an ex google man in charge?

There are currently too many platforms and windows phone 7 has been a flop IMO. I know people with blackberries, iphones and a miriad of android phones, but I have yet to speak to any of my friends who have a windows phone 7 or even feel remotely tempted to have one. Even the tie in with xbox live isnt enough to bring people around. Its lacking in features, and doesnt really bring anything good to the table, apple, android and RIM do everything that windows phone 7 does and more. The interface with the tiles isnt too bad, but its not a patch on an iphone or an android in my opinion.

Nokia could have done something really good with android but given the microsoft restrictions where can Nokia shine against the likes of HTC or LG?

[Mage]

I can't tell

Is this is really clever or complete suicide for Nokia?

Android would be no good as everyone is doing it.

Their problem is that Meego isn't ready, probably "wrong" because it's part Intel and They messed up the GUI aspects of symbian.

Also Phones are becoming "lego" kits. Samsung, Texas, Qualcomm, Marvell lego. Not actually clever Apple, HTC , Motorola or Nokia hardware.

[Anonymous Coward]

"Android would be no good as everyone is doing it."

Thats tosh, Android is the core, you make a phone using Android, benefit if you wish from Google Services (maps, calendar, gmail, sync etc), but you can certainly skin it how you like.

HTC, Samsung and Sony have all done very different takes on a core Android OS, Nokia could have done the same.

[Adam Trickett]

Failure meet Disaster

This is bad news for Nokia, and alas bad news for Linux and various OS project (e.g. MeeGo and QT/KDE). Microsoft will destroy Nokia if they are allowed too.

For MS it's good publicity but I don't even think Nokia can save the Windows Phone platform now. Perhaps this will allow Microsoft to escape the phone business without losing face.

As others have said this is a "merger of the failures" and probably isn't going to save either of them.

Google, Apple, Samsung, LG and Motorola will be laughing all the way to the bank.

[Anonymous Coward]

Qt will not go anywhere

While I'm also saddened by this news (although, Nokia had to do *something*, and as Android phones are a dime in a dozen, it's hard to differentiate there), I really have no fear for the future of Qt. It is LGPL, and it will be developed, at least by the OSS community if nothing else. Case in point, Phonon (a "multimediamedia abstraction layer", if you will) was originally from KDE4 but now ships with Qt as well.

[Conrad Longmore]

It's desperate..

It's desperate.. but Nokia had dug itself into a hole. Symbian is dying, MeeGo is a no-show. Nokia will carry some clout with Nokia, and WP7 could certainly use some Nokia input.

Microsoft get the better part of the deal though - WP7 shipments should shoot up (even if the handsets are only a modest success), they get the advantage of Nokia's input into UI design (which they can then sell on) and it's finally a significant WIN for MS in this sector.

Nokia on the other hand are taking the risks - WP7 might not sell well to consumers, but then they're still not quite in the last chance saloon.. they could always license Android as well!

[Tom Richardson]

This is a terrible, terrible idea.

Nuff said.

[Anonymous Coward]

Pathertic

It was a good ride while it lasted. Well, despite the bumps on the way.

I am a bit sad as Qt is quite good. Can someone take on the lead for it?

Oh, and as for my title. I refer you to the comments section on allaboutsymbian.com. The fanbois death rattle is truly pathetic.

[MJI]

No more Nokia

We have had company Nokias for a few years, currently an X6.

Looks like we will have to go elsewhere at contract renewal.

Perhaps it will be Android time

[Greg J Preece]

God DAMN IT!

Maemo's a great system, but they dropped it like a hot brick.

MeeGo was looking like it could be really good, but we all know what's going to happen there now.

Guess I'm back to Android for my next phone. :-(

[Anonymous Cowherder]

The title is required, and must contain letters and/or digits, just like my wife.

Way to back the wrong horse guys!

Long been said that nokia hardware has long been held back by their software, they had a chance here to get that right.

I ditched Nokia in about 2002 and switched to Sony-Ericcson, last year I switched to android but had hoped that nokia would do the same. htc are good phones, as are the samsungs, a nokia running android would have been bulletproof, ah well.

As for microsoft, not enough phails in the world on the desktop/server level so they now persist in entertaining us all with their foray into the mobile market.

Keep up the good work guys! rofl.

[whats the point of kenny lynch?]

err.. M$ already has multimap....

hey nokia! -

microsoft doesn't need yer shite mapping service, they already own multimap, did they tell you that they'd use yours? oh dear...

and get a tablet out this year running....oh.....ok...maybe not....

[Anonymous Coward]

Give it a chance

This could be interesting. Nokia makes excellent hardware: the N8 is an absolutely lovely handset that is just lacking an OS/user experience/apps to unlock the full potential. Even their lower end phones are nicely constructed, just Symbian S60 is so creaky to use. S^3 is an improvement and it could potentially become even better. Nokia seem reluctant to retire it, and there is a massive existing install base that mainly just want to make calls and send texts.

Winmo 7 is by all accounts pretty nice, and I'm sure Microsoft aren't being complacent about the competition. We also have Windows 8 on ARM coming up which will probably have some overlap with Winmo 7. It will take time to build an ecosystem on par with Google and Apple, but if anyone has the cash to see it through, it's Microsoft.

Perhaps Nokia will implement a nice way of compiling apps built on Qt for all platforms (Symbian, Winmo and Meego). Perhaps some sort of virtual machine to run legacy Symbian apps on Winmo? Ovi merging with Winmo app store?

Nokia are now in a good position to emulate the success of handset makers like HTC and Samsung, with a choice of operating systems. If they allowed people to even change OS, they could win a lot of fans back. I bet tinkerers would love to be able to buy a Nokia handset and install Meego on it. But then again that would perhaps open the doors for stuff like Android ports, which maybe they wouldn't want.

[Kristian Walsh]

Slightly optimistic, but wither Qt?

Details aren't out yet, obviously, but If the "we'll use Microsoft tools" is true, and Nokia haven't insisted that WinPhone7 supports Qt, then they've missed a big opportunity. Doing this would unite Symbian, Meego and WindowsPhone under a single user interface library, and make application development easier.

What of MeeGo? Looks like it's not dead, just pushed into tablets. Personally, I think that's a good thing - Linux still is not up (down?) to the task of running on such power-constrained devices as mobiles, and its performance on non-x86 platforms has always been lacking. An Atom-based MeeGo tablet, though... that could definitely be on my shopping list.

Ironically, after all the hate, it's Symbian that lives to fight again. Mid-range handsets will continue on Symbian with Qt. As the current S^3 hardware platform moves down the price range, this could be real competition to Android, which frankly sucks on anything less than a 1GHz A8.

I guess this was a good business decision overall: Nokia have never been able to connect to the US customer the way MS do. Outside of North America, Microsoft had no traction with mobile carriers, and all the while, Google were undermining MS's previous hardware partners.

It's always worth remembering that you are not the phonemaker's customer - their customers are O2, Vodafone, T-Mobile, AT&T and the like. You can bet that these customers will buy and carry Nokia phones with WinPhone7 faster than they'd carry Nokia Phones with Android. There's distrust from operators about Android - it's better than Apple, but it's still data-hungry and nothing is ever "free" - sooner or later they (and then we) will have to pay for it.

Finally, that Google VP's comment about two turkeys not making an eagle could end up having a double reading. True, neither company has been a roaring success in the US smartphone market but: eagles are an endangered species, and come the holiday season, everyone's looking for a turkey :)

[Anonymous Coward]

You want WHAT?

You can have tablets on mips (loongson), or a variety of arm implementations, and you want atom? Just because android is sluggish on arm?

IMO nokia should fret a lot less about the US. Europe is just as big an economy and a much larger market in "unlocked" phones to boot. Now I don't know much about the market in the US but it seems to me the big players are RIM (king of email-on-a-mobile-device), apple (caesar of the UI), and google (overlords of geekiness). Every one is a very tall order to outdo, and with redmond licensing, competing on price isn't going to leave any margin. So by putting his lame duck's focus there, Elop is setting up for failure.

The problem with being a turkey isn't thanksgiving. It's that there's so many of them nobody notices which're gone afterward.

[Kristian Walsh]

Let me rephrase that:

I wouldn't mind a tablet. It might replace the nasty, nasty MacBook Air that I currently try to use for casual web viewing. (Obviously, adequate thermal management comes a distant second to "magical design" these days)

I do not want something running Android, for reasons to do with Google, and its hungry hippo hardware attitude to system resources.

The iPad is okay but it's bland, and in the form of iTunes it's got baggage I don't want to deal with - plus, I believe that I should have the right to do what I want with my property. Oddly enough, this is the reason I like MacOS X...

Anyway, Nokia's MeeGo offered the chance of something that was elegantly designed, and functional enough for me to use for more than just mindless consumption.

[Alan Bourke]

And so the blinkered, unquestioning MS hate begins ..

... despite the plain facts that Win Phone 7 is actually not bad at all, Symbian is dead, and Nokia will be relegated to a very distant runner-up if they don't do this.

[Anonymous Coward]

No

No WP7 is VERY bad...

I'm guessing the US is just waking up, and the MS shills are out in force to try and pretend that someone cares about WP7...

[Anonymous Coward]

@AC 1319

Yes, because that's the only way that anyone could differ from your opinion about MS is if they are paid by them.

Well, I like my Windows phone, the only people I've met who don't like Win Phone 7 are people who haven't tried using it. It's not perfect but it's pretty good.

Oh and guess what? I don't work for MS, nor am I ever likely to.

[fiddley]

You must have a title

Me too, I've already posted positively elsewhere on this thread and will continue to do so.Given how much anti WP7 vitriol is thrown around here, it's amazing anyone will stick their head above the parapet and claim to like it. It's testament to just how good the software is that people still choose to do so.

Oh, and when *did* this "shill" trolling start for when people have an opinion which goes against the grain? It's a recent phenomena, but is it still only prepubescent boys that do it, or are the girls copying them as well now?

[Drew Scott]

So many recommendations for Android?

Honestly I totally understand the reasoning for going for WP7, rather than Android. Nokia would be late to market with an Android phone and there would be absolutely nothing to differentiate themselves. The other WP7 manufacturers all seem to be putting out Android phones too, and possibly that is where their focus will be.

If Nokia can carve a niche as the dominante WP7 phone manufacturer then that might mean lower sales, but more profits than jumping in with Android - apart from anything else Microsoft is not going to want to see Nokia pinning their hopes on WP7 as a failure.

[Anonymous Coward]

Here's one...

I don't want to deal with Google, I don't want them to leech my information and I don't trust them more than I don't trust MS.

I like my evil multinational corporations to be up front about it.

My partner has an Android phone and the amount of information it (at least initially) sent to Google was really shocking.

[simpfeld]

Nokia - Disconnecting People

..certainly developers

[Andus McCoatover]

Err, we used to say..

NOKIA

Connecting People

ONKIA

Disconnecting Fishes

(Onkia = angling)

So, now NOKIA has rebranded itself, and renamed.

[moylan]

it's not often...

it's not often that you see rats jumping on a sinking ship!

[Ocular Sinister]

Well, that's the end of Nokia then

It looks like its game over for Nokia. I still have fond memories of the early Nokias - great phones for their time.

[James Pickett]

Surprise

Ex-MS man tells company how wonderful MS is. Doesn't he remember why he left?

I was going (today) to buy a new, simple phone for my son. It would have been a Nokia, but now I'm not so sure. The same applies to mine, when I replace it, assuming it ever wears out, which seems unlikely so far...

[John 62]

re: surprise

your simple Nokia phone will likely work well for a long time no matter what MS or Nokia does in the future. But I do know someone with a Nokia 6700. Works well enough, but the settings menus are a nightmare and it doesn't have manual screen brightness control. And it's never off the charger. And it's their third one because they took the first two back for not holding a charge.

[MinionZero]

"It's official: Nokia backs wrong horse for smartphones" - Their fixed that for you. ;)

Joking aside, I've made it very clear in the past, I don't trust Google's growing omnipresence global spying plans, I hate it and I hate their bosses for being so two faced about it, (as my previous posts shows), but that said, even I have to admit what Google are doing with Android is basically the right thing. (I could write pages on the ways Google are spying on the phone, but that's another issue for another time).

It is the right way (more or less) to build an open platform that everyone supports. Even better its basically Linux based. Apple keep showing they are building walls around their platform restricting developers (and Apples prices are way to high) whereas Android is very open and ever cheaper Android phones are starting to appear. It won't replace the desktop for everyone, (desktop, why am I talking about a desktop!?), yes its a phone OS, for now, but the tablets show its got the potential to even erode into the desktop market in time, (imagine a tablet for say just £50 (in a few years from now) and then tell me that won't help the majority of non-technical users).

Ironically this very simplified Android UI could be the way Linux finally takes over the desktop market as well for the non-technical users. Its the simplified UI that's been called for by some for years, (as non-technical is the vast majority of the market, it just does what they want) but in the past, every time its been called for to be simpler, the die hard people have shot it down, wanting a more complex UI (that's ok for us technical people, I want that!). Well now Google's done what's needed with the UI. Its certainly going to mean within a few years more Linux computers are going to be running in people's homes than Windows computers! ... that's bloody good news for Linux. :)

If I was working at Microsoft I would want to make deals with people like Nokia to try to hold off the growth of Android, but it won't work. I wonder what the hidden details of that deal are?

Also all the mobile phone OS's highlight and destroy the myth that every home user must have compatibility with Microsoft and Intel, so that's a direct threat to their market dominance. They are talking about 850M Android devices within only a few years from now. Soon after that it will be easily well over 1B+ devices.

Just a few days ago we were reading that great TheReg article about DEC founder Ken Olsen and back when DEC were so dominant, it would have been utterly unthinkable to suggest that DEC could ever fall, yet times change. Linux fans have long suggested the end of Microsoft dominance and secretly even Microsoft have worried about Linux. Well now, Microsoft have very good reason to be worried.

[Jim Coleman]

Oh yes!

I don't give a shit if I'm the only person on the planet that thinks this, but I'm very happy that Nokia have climbed on board the WP7 bandwagon. This will help WP7 become a true contender with iOS and Android in terms of sales - WP7 is in my opinion already a contender in terms of UI. I like it a lot and think it deserves to succeed and turn the marketplace for smartphones into a 3-horse race. The increased competition can only be good for consumers in the end, after all.

I don't understand why anyone would want the market to be dominated by one OS or another. Let's make sure the consumer has CHOICE. Today's announcement will help that happen.

Nokia make outstanding hardware and that will help them obtain a lead over the other WP7 phone makers.

[Anonymous Coward]

Symbian^3, Symbian Resurrection, Symbian vs Predator.

The Nokia Smartphone OS horror story enters its final reel, leaving a trail of corpses (Maemo, Meego, Nota...). It is a pity they couldn't get their act together in recent years.

[JimC]

There was

There was a young lady of Riga,

Who rode with a smile on a tiger;

hey returned from the ride

With the lady inside,

And the smile on the face of the tiger.

[foo_bar_baz]

Riga doesn't rhyme with tiger

The post is required, and must contain letters.

[Anonymous Coward]

It does if...

...like me, you don't know how to pronounce Riga.

[Ocular Sinister]

The stock markets are impressed...

NOT! http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/overview?symbol=NOK1V.HE

[Righteously Indignant]

WinPho7 on a Nokia....

I can't be the only one that is interested in a Nokia handset running Windows Phone 7 surely? Ok, Nokia have been on the decline of late but when they put their mind to it they can put out some impressive, well designed and reliable hardware. (I said reliable hardware, not software...)

Windows Phone 7 is actually quite good to use - once you get past the horror of Zune. (that said, it is better than itunes) So there is potential here for a good OS on good hardware - why all the haters?

I still put Nokia ahead of the likes of LG and Samsung when it comes to hardware quality; Motorola will never see another penny from me after the shafting that was the Milestone; Android just isn't that reliable and is now fragmented to hell and back. Iphones are fine for the people that like them, but I can't get past the forced obsolescence and proprietary interfaces.

I have no beef with HTC, but annoyingly the Mozart is only available on Orange in the UK...

So I am now eagerly awaiting a nice Microkia phone - I may be disappointed, but I like to think that these guys both know this is their last chance so they will go the extra mile. Instead of sniping and all the 'RIP Nokia' - give them a chance and see what they can do.

[Peter Bond]

I'm sorry

but this announcement was bleedin' obvious. If the Nokia N8 ran WP7 it would have sold considerably better than it has done. The benefits for both companies are blindingly obvious and I suspect in 18 months time it will seen as a wise move on both parts. Nokia make bloody good hardware, WP7 is a pretty decent OS for one only four months old - 2+2 = 4.

[Anonymous Coward]

@ Peter Bond "I'm Sorry"

Don't know if it will have sold better, it would have sold to a different market. I'm sure I'm not the only N8 user who would not have touched it with a bargepole had it been WinPho7 rather than Symbian.

[Shonko Kid]

"considerably better"

In what way? They managed to ship a few million of them in the space of a couple of months. iPhone 1 never managed that. Neither has many (all?) of the Android handsets.

You could qualify that with an "..in the US" but I'm pretty sure that each one of those US sales would've been at the cost of at least 3 everywhere else.

[m1keFB]

The Scorpion and the Frog

Reminds me of the famous fable . .

Just wondering how long it will take for Microsoft to sting Nokia?

[Mark Goodson]

Two turkeys do not an eagle make...

I think this is about the only thing Nokia could do, but it's a defensive play. Microsoft avoid Win Mob 7 disappearing without trace and Nokia get a new OS, help building the ecosystem that they need, search, etc. But I think it's too little too late. As other contributors say... for individuals (rather than large corporations) buying smartphones, Nokia and Win Mob 7 aren't even in the pick list. It will also scupper a lot of other markets for Microsoft... I'm sure Samsung are busy killing any new Windows phone projects at this very minute.

[Smudge@mcr]

Phones are now fashion items

Sadly what Nokia failed to appreciate is that since the iPhone came to market, Smart phones are fashion items and brand is as important as functionality for many buyers. (sad but true).

MS is not a fashionable brand.

In fact with this tie up Nokia has re-branded itself as the fashion equivalent of a tweed jacket with leather patches on the elbows.

oh dear...

[dogged]

fashions change

Slower in hardware than clothing but nevertheless, they change very quickly. If Nokia backed Android and it became unfashionable, this would be just as poor a decision.

[Dinky Carter]

Nokia's kiss of death strikes again

As an ex-Symbianite I'm too battle-hardened to really care any more about Nokia dumping all over Symbian (smoothering a lean, mean and advanced core with a huge steaming pile of Series60.) But I'm angry about Qt. Yet again, Nokia has taken a wonderful technology, f^cked it over and then effectively dumped it. But for Nokia's meddling, I'm sure Qt would've been officially supported (by Trolltech) on iOS, WP7, Android and BlackBerry by now. But even though Qt on WP7 would've been a potent combination, Qt looks set to wither under Nokia's toxic fosterage.

[The BigYin]

End of the line

I have always owned Nokia phones - but I will cease to be their customer if they only ship MS. I do not want that Redmond crap on my handset thank you. Same probably goes for my partner as well.

It's been nice knowing you Nokia, but your days are now numbered.

[Anonymous Coward]

Sums it up nicely for me... much LOL

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/business/microsoft--applies-make%11up-to-nokia's-corpse-201102113537/

Beer... it's Friday

[hyartep]

very well written!!!

wow! the first article by andrew orlowski about nokia, that has comments enabled and also the first article where I fully agree with him. :-)

note: fail icon is for nokia, article quality is win.

[Anonymous Coward]

Title

The first by him in months that I didn't close after reading the first two lines! And not a single "tard", maybe that was the big difference... :)

[Andus McCoatover]

Love the piccie of the two Cheshire Cats

Elop: "Hey, Steve, my bestest new mate. Seems I've no-where to sit in this photo-shoot.

Be a pal and lob us a cha.." OOPS!

[Anonymous Coward]

RIP from Ex Psion

Being Ex Psion I have liked the Nokia smart phones the E series and they have been my dependable work phones. Now I'm ZTE blade with Android 2.2 (£100 quid). It does exchange, pop, gmail and Opera is a top notch optimised browser. I will not be going back to Nokia now Microsoft is involved. Nokia missed the boat, they needed responsive UI's and just took too long to get there.

Android lacks the maturity of some of the Nokia (email ) applications, but it will not take Google long I hope.

Now if some one can add the features the Goolge applications need ( the features Nokia had ) and have a option for deGooglelizing the phone ( for people that want data privacy ) Andriod is a winner.

[John 62]

Could be interesting

Can't wait for the XBox Live! and NGage merger :)

Seriously though, does this mean Nokia will end up as exclusive MS Phone partner by default? Symbian started out cross-vendor, then went to Nokia only as everyone else jumped ship.

Does this also mean that WinPho7 will start getting more regular updates? The platform intrigues me. There are a few things I used to be able to do with my trusty SEk750i that my iPhone can't (BluePhone Elite integration, for one - backing up ALL your text messages to you PC is very handy). If WinPho7 turns out to have these things and plays acceptably well with OS X, then I'd definitely consider a WinPho7 handset when my now venerable iPhone 3G dies.

[Khephren]

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

Anyone remember Commodore? Losing market share so they brought in an exec and engineer from the IBM PC world. Killed commodore stone dead.

Jumping from your own ailing (but massive) platform, to a company who already failed in the market place, and are on their second attempt? corporate stupidity.

Goodbye Nokia, in your greed to boost profits, you'll be lucky to survive in any form after this.

[Guillermo Lo Coco]

It was nice....

Nokia -> Bye bye bye!

[Tim Walker]

Maybe I'm the only one here to think this, but...

...I actually think Symbian^3 isn't "dated", "horrible UI", or any of the terms that are flung around here like monkey droppings.

I know these factors are inevitably personal and subjective, but you'd think from what people say about S^3, that it's impossible to get anything done on a device sporting it. Yes, the UI is different from iOS/Android/WP7/whatever (which seems to be at the heart of many complaints about it), but personally I find it logical and usable, even familiar (as an owner of four other Nokias since the late 90s).

And yes, I have seen/tried iOS/Android - nice enough on the eye-candy front, and I could live with them, but I just prefer the S^3 approach myself, which is why the idea of it vanishing doesn't exactly appeal.

I make no apologies for being a mostly-satisfied Nokia N8 user (yes, even I have a few niggles, but I haven't found the perfect phone yet). I know that may put me in the minority here, but I felt I wanted to stick up for the poor thing...

(and I've tried to be polite and non-inflammatory here - disagree with me if you must, but please be civil in return ;-) )

[Colin Critch]

I agree with you

The thought of S3 not being around when you have been using it since S1 is a bit frighting. I wanted Symbian to succeed but they have just had a too big gap on UI and performance ( responsiveness). It will take a bit of time for S3 to die but you have to ask yourself as a user how long are you willing to wait for a decent UI, responsiveness and regular software upgrade service. Nokia made margins out of less hardware cost because S3 EPOC could JUST ABOUT get away with it. It wont be able to do that with W7.

[no-one in particular]

Why assume all is lost for Qt?

> Nokia haven't insisted that WinPhone7 supports Qt

Um, wrong way around? You support the OS within Qt...

And Qt already supports WinCE

[GrundHolm-The-Illigitamate]

Oh, the sweet irony...

A long time ago (about nine years) in a country far, far away (Finland) there was a young man called JPZR. He used to wax lyrically about the failings of Nokia phones and the company's lack of insight as to what people wanted. He said there should be music players, long before Nokia put MP3 capability on their phones, and so on.

Unfortunately, young JPRZ had a not so good way of expressing himself. In stead of saying, for ex. "I say, these phones are rather lacking in trendy features." It would come out something like "F#&%ing Nokia have f!?&ed up again. The Nokia N785037 is total sh!t!!!" If you get my drift. This was a pity, as he often had a valid point. He would often compare Nokia phones with Microsoft based ones. However, most folk took him up on his presentation rather than his technical content.

He was also pretty keen on the Microsoft OS for phones, even, IRC, contributing in some form. This didn't sit too well with his employer, either. Which just happened to be Nokia. Poor JPZR was cast out, branded a traitor and gob-shite.

Looks like he gets the last laugh!

[Anonymous Coward]

Cue the Fanboys

From some deluded fanboy half a page above, talking about Android and Google:

>It is the right way (more or less) to build an open platform that everyone supports.

Well, guess what? Obviously NOT everyone supports that platform. Duh!

[Wang N Staines]

Sad day...

I expected WP7 to fail but didn't want Nokia to be dragged down with it.

[launcap]

And what are HTC/Samsung et. al. going to do?

Since they now have one of their direct competitors (Nokia) having a major say in WP7.. I suspect they are going to drop it like a brick down a well. Which will reduce the number of WP7 phones coming to market and dely/stop it becoming a major platform.

I too remember when Nokia stood for progress and technology. Sad to see them becoming just another box shifter.

[Bruno Girin]

Bye, bye Nokia

You went for the quick fix and threw away years of great engineering in Qt, MeeGo and Symbian. Well, you'll realise that your customers can throw you away too.

[Giles Jones]

Well...

If it was great engineering why are they screwed now?

Nokia's biggest failure was ignoring the touch screen market for way too long. Even recent flagship phones like the N95 weren't touch screen.

Sony Ericsson had the P800 and P990 which was a touch screen version of Symbian. P800 was around about 2002, some five years before the iPhone showed up. Did Nokia respond to the P800 and others? did they hell. Too busy sticking to their stuck record of traditional keypad phones.

I had a Nokia before I got an iPhone 3G and it was pretty dire in terms of usability. Lots of features but ultimately none of them got any use due to terrible usability. An example being that the phone could read out text messages, but if you didn't hear it first time you couldn't replay it again.

So combined with the lack of firmware updates it wasn't a brilliant phone. I got one update, they released another for a different country but never in the UK, even that never fixed all the bugs people were complaining about.

Aren't Nokia also famous for good hardware? if so then why do so many screen backlights go on their slider phones?

When using the GPS software on my Nokia Navigator with a car charger it would display "charging" then about 15 minutes later "charging complete" and then 15 minutes later "charging" and so on. Just sloppy hardware design and very distracting when driving.

[Mark .]

"Losers alliance"?

There's plenty to be concerned about the news - but POV comments like this are nonsense. Nokia are the number one phone company - even if Android did make number one in one single quarter, Nokia are still the largest selling company, and Symbian is still doing very well as a platform.

Now possibily I misinterpret, and it's the opinion that this announcement will lead them to doom. Possibly. Although I suspect that Microsoft have plenty to gain. Nokia ship more phones than anyone else, and I doubt most people give a damn about the OS.

I feel sad that Nokia are supporting Microsoft, rather than open source Symbian and Meego (the latter also being based on Linux). OTOH, why isn't there this level of criticism against the far more closed and walled-garden Apple (who also made a deal with Microsoft once, let's not forget)?

As for the comments - it's been a long trend that people have whinged about Nokia in the comments of geek articles, whilst Nokia have continued to go from strength to strength, as the number one company, with increasing sales. I have concern about this announcement - but the fact that so many people here seem to dislike it suggests to me that actually they may do very well, if the past is anything to go by ;)

I'm also amused at the irony that for years, the Nokia-haters have been saying that Nokia should ditch Symbian. And when they say they will, that's bad too! You can't have it both ways - people like me are sad because we liked what Nokia are doing. But if you didn't, why do you care about them changing direction?

GregC: I think that sums up my feelings too. Despite people loving to bash Nokia, I love my Nokia 5800. And choice in the phone market - Android, Symbian, Maemo/Meego - was a good thing. All of them open source too. Android is okay - but I still feel that having to move to that as my only choice, as a least-worse, is a rather depressing idea. Who knows, maybe they'll do something good with Windows Phone; but I'd rather Nokia were supporting open source operating systems, and Qt.

"too many handsets, too little development of Symbian"

Too many handsets? Why is that a problem? And if you are worried about Symbian development, all the more reason it's good to go elsewhere, right?

"Should have been android "

That would've been bad too. I like Symbian - and moreover, the choice is good. It has things I like that Android doesn't (offline mapping, non-crap battery life, Qt development). Now, if they could have added the best of Symbian to Android, that would be good too I guess. If you think Symbian is so bad, why the concern at losing it?

I agree they should consider HTC etc as the competitors (the media miss this point too, preferring to compare phones on OS rather than manufacturers). But "coalition of losers" is just nonsense.

Jim Coleman: I agree that choice is good. But I think that's also a reason to be sad by this: we already have WP7 phones if we want them; but losing Symbian will be less choice.

[Colin Critch]

What is Apple?

What is Apple?

[gautam]

How the mighty have fallen !

Earlier post mentioned 6310i as the high point / pinnacle of Nokia desginers. I Differ. I think it was the N95 8GB and also the N97 (hardware & designwise), only to be let down by S60 v5.

Had to return mine 3 times and then forever, only to settle for SE Satio (again the same pathetic Symbian experience despite hardware being top notch.).. Its still boxed with the screen protection wrapper still on.

Wish what could've been. Sigh. Why oh Why?

[captain veg]

It's me. Very sorry. everyone.

I had a succession of PalmOS phones, which were great. Palm licenced WM, went down the toilet. So I got a N900. Now it's Nokia's turn.

Sorry.

-A.

[Anonymous Coward]

Android was never a good idea.

They already invested a shedload of resources into their own linux based OS - Meego. It makes no sense to go for yet another linux based OS, and invest yet more resources in putting their stamp on it.

Even if they did go with Android, Nokia aren't exactly renowned for a slick or intuitive user experience, so can you imagine what a hack job they'd probably do of skinning Android?

I've only seen videos of Maemo and Meego, so can't really comment too much on those, they look better than Symbian, but still miles away from the level of polish on iOS, Android... even WP7

[Yet Another Anonymous coward]

Left hand - right hand

At Nokia the left hand DOES know what the right hand is doing, the left hand has 1000 of middle managers all launching strategy boutiques to undermine what the right hand is doing. And the right hand is doing exactly the same to the left.

If only Nokia could compete with Apple and Android as vigorously as it competes with Nokia - all would have been wonderful.

[mraak]

Expert in imaging?

What does that mean? We'll go back in time when companies were selling mobile wallpapers for £3 each? Now I can 5 great games for this.

[zanto]

thank you nokia

the 5110, 3315, 9300 and e71 will be cherished. i wish i got me a n900 and 6310i as well, now i just can't get myself to shell out any more money on you.

you built some truly great phones in your day. no wonder that i cannot get my self to part with my 9300.

now not only are you on a burning rig staring at the frigid waters below, you also have a fat balding man about to hurl a chair at you. have a nice day, bye bye.

[Anonymous Coward]

Just to say...

That's me off Nokia's customer list in the future.

Just as the phone industry is discovering exciting stuff, Nokia discovers Microsoft.

Bye, then...

[Anonymous Coward]

A perfect fit

Microsoft and Nokia were made for each other. An outsider to Nokia would be astounded to see how much the Symbian tail wags the product dog. You could (and I'm sure people have) come up with a category-killer app or handset and if it turned out that it didn't fit with (or, heaven forbid, exposed a flaw in) Symbian's vision then you could sleep easy knowing that Nokia would kill the product then nuke the dev center responsible just to be sure that the idea didn't spread. Windows Mobile brings all that plus the bonus of Microsoft "innovation" making sure that any good ideas that don't need to be nuked are buried in an avalanche of broken knockoffs.

[James 47]

@A perfect fit

As a Nokia employee, can I say that your post is complete nonsense. There is no 'Symbian tail' or 'Symbian vision'. That is the problem. No-one took responsibility for anything. The same happened for the N9 which was cancellled. Nokia management refused to accept this and now they are in the position they are... turning Nokia into Dell.

It's actually really amusing... in order for Nokia to survive until the first Windows phones start to ship it needs Symbian to be a success! Jo Harlow described it as a 'cash-cow'. Nokia has been duped, its shareholders (who rightly wanted change) are in for a shock. Elop won't be around for much longer.

[Manu T]

F U Microkia

This is it!

F U Nokia. My next phone will be Android. If only to make you both fail even more!

As of now I want to trade my Nokia phone for a six-pack of beers (preferably Duvel)

So long suckers

[paddy carroll 1]

Ballmer

Sacry - look at the Jared Loughner smile!

[dogged]

Massive shock of self-realization

I just realized why I want Microsoft and Nokia to succeed. Partly, sure it's because more competition is good for everyone.

But mostly it's because so many people don't. The frothing hatred we see against the Wp7 platform makes me want to buy a Nokia WP7 just because you clearly don't want to let me have one.

I also hope this streak of contrariness is very common and that you all die in an immense fire.

[DEAD4EVER]

nokia and microsoft

hum this will not survive both will probably fail as apple and android are dominating badly

[Grubby]

Another slow giant

Nokia had it all in their industry, domination of the fastest growing industry of the last decade. Their downfall was lack of evolution and too much reliance on a market they expected would be very stable and unchanging. They didn't predict smart phones and when they finally did realise it was the future, it was already the present for the likes of Google, Apple and RIM.

Microsoft had it all in their industry, domination..... you see where this is going?

2 big, slow to react companies joining forces make 1 huge, slow to react company.

[Simon B]

say goodbye to using your memory cards

Like using memory cards on your phone? say goodbye to it with Win7 - Msoft onlt allow them.