back to article Apple sued over hot iPad shutdowns

Apple's iPad can shut down if it gets too hot, and Jacob Baltazar, Claudia Keller, and John Browning are as mad as hell and aren't going to take it anymore. Those unhappy iPadders have filed suit against Apple — and they're asking the court to elevate their claim to class-action status. Their lawsuit, filed in the US District …

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  1. Steven Raith
    Boffin

    Advertised as "it goes where you go"

    Or goes anywhere, or similar, IIRC (someone else can google the ad), and terms of use state otherwise if you live anywhere other than somewhere described as 'temperate' then that isn't the case?

    Aren't there rules about that in terms of advertising standards?

    Curious, as opposed to iHating, for what it's worth.

    Steven R

    1. Nexox Enigma

      It probably does..

      """Advertised as "it goes where you go""""

      But did they promise it'd work?

      But yeah, this time of year, most of this country (The big one w/ all the guns) is well over 95 degrees F for most of the day (and in many (miserable) places, all night too.) I guess that's why aircon is so popular around there - to keep the iPads from shutting down.

    2. Jeremy Chappell

      Would you sit there?

      So we're talking about strong sunlight - you'd wear a hat right? Or find some shade? The iPad needs similar consideration.

      The amazing thing is nobody said the display was unreadable!

      All electronic devices have conditions they cannot operate in, putting a system in direct sunlight and expecting it to continue to work seems - well foolish.

      1. DrXym Silver badge

        Ereaders would cope better

        "So we're talking about strong sunlight - you'd wear a hat right? Or find some shade? The iPad needs similar consideration."

        It could still be hot enough in the shade to turn off. I guess the suit's merits rest on whether the device shuts down inside or outside of its published operating range. I imagine it doesn't help the iPad's heat disappation (vs an ereader for example) that it must remain in a high power state burning watts to power the CPU and the display.

      2. Doshu

        Interesting point, but...

        ... aside from the obvious display problems, i would expect a device to keep on operating.

        I'd be more than a little irked if my phone was unavailable in an emergency because i'd spent a little time in sunlight (the phone being a similar take-anywhere device -- especially if one considers the iphone) .

        To put into context, sitting outside it's happened that i've left my phone lying around on, say, a picnic table in direct exposure. It kept right on working when needed.

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    Why sue?

    Just take the piece of crap back and get your money back. Frigging greedy arseholes piss me off. And I hate apple with passion.

    1. Jeremy Chappell
      Pint

      Like the iPhone

      This is the same nonsense as has people wanting legal action over the iPhone. They want the impossible (a phone that defies the laws of physics and isn't affected by interaction with a "bag of mostly water" or a tablet can can be baked in the sun and still continue to function) but when offered their money back they don't actually want to give these "defective" products up.

      I don't have an iPhone, but I do have an iPad - I think it's great, of course living in the UK, I'm pretty unlikely to see it shutdown because of excessive sunlight. But if I do I'll probably trot off to a nice cool pub so it can cool down, and me too ;-)

      1. Tigra 07

        False Advertising

        I think you will find that they clearly just want apple to stop lying in their advertising.

        That's why they aren't seeking damages, but a fine.

        Maybe they're holding it wrong?

        1. Anonymous Coward
          FAIL

          Actually,

          They just want a phone that works when you touch one finger to the bottom left of the phone - like every other phone. It looks like you've been drinking down the FUD that Steve has been throwing around. The iPhone has 2 signal attenuation problems. Attenuation caused by holding it is minimal (just like with every other phone). Shorting the antenna is only possible on the iPhone, because they were the only clueless muppets who put a shortable antenna on the outside of the phone.

          Clearly you are a fanbois.

    2. Doug Glass
      Go

      Not greedy ...

      ... just unable to reason properly by themselves. What selfrespecting Apple flog wants to be seen actually complaining in the The Sacred J's own house? Far better to hide behind a faceless class action suit. Of couse at least on of the juvemiles has to show his hand, or face, but some people are more brave than smart maybe.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Why?

      "Just take the piece of crap back and get your money back. Frigging greedy arseholes piss me off. And I hate apple with passion."

      You can't. Apple are refusing to give people their money back because they say there's nothing wrong with the devices you numb nuts!

  3. smeddy
    Heart

    Love

    Teg, I love your writing style

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The formula is wrong

    Jobs will post a statement claiming that Apple is "stunned to find that the formula used to calculate how hot the ipad gets is totally wrong"

    1. Pablo

      Maybe

      But in this case that could be a legitimate answer, if it's incorrectly shutting down long before it's at risk of suffering damage that would be a rare case where a firmware patch could actually fix it.

      1. Doug Glass
        Go

        Uh Huh

        Just like a patch was supposed to fix the signal strength huh? The Sacred J will say anything and do anything to get the bois back in suckling position.

    2. Doug Glass
      Go

      Cooling

      Or start selling piezoelectric cooling covers with heat dissipating gills.

  5. David McMahon
    FAIL

    Yes but

    Did they hold it correctly?

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Coat

    Are they....

    Holding it the right way?

    Mine's the one with the "I just had to..." on the back.

    1. Antidisestablishmentarianist
      Stop

      Sadly

      Such comments on 'orientation' officially got 'old' after the 6243rd posting. Yours is the 7821st, so it's time to get a new quip lest ye embarrass yourself.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        No sense of humor...

        Not to sound disrespectful, belligerent or confrontational, but are you serious? Between the *nix folks and fruity fanboi’s foaming at the mouth when Microsoft stumbles and the Windows & Fanboi’s berating the hell out of any open source or *nix, you’re damn right I’m going to go out of my way to voice my opinion when Apple does not one but multiple stupid things, because I think it’s freaking hysterical!

        Yes, they have developed some amazing technology over the past couple decades, but as a multiple Mac owner, I can recall some fairly serious hardware flaws going all the way back to the Mac SE. I’m sorry, that’s not innovative, that’s just rushing product through the design and manufacturing phases just to suit the sales weenies and Mr. Jobs’ ego. Who gets left holding the bag? The consumer does.

        If you remember the Apple // and //+ & //e series, they had horrendous problems with power supplies. Just about every Macintosh has had heat problems, whether it be transformers in the self-contained mac’s, to poorly designed cooling manifolds, to insufficient thermal paste, placed on the CPU’s to undersized cooling fans. I’m sorry, but you’d figure after 30 years of being in the business of designing and manufacturing moderately high to overpriced equipment, they might pay a little more attention some of the products that suffered, due to rushed, poorly designed or shoddily manufactured equipment.

  7. Leo Stretch
    Jobs Halo

    A title is required here

    Just move to a colder climate.

    Not that big of a deal.

  8. This post has been deleted by a moderator

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Troll

      Newsnight on Monday

      Your post reminded me of last Monday's edition of Newsnight, live from Sheffield, debating the coalition government.

      Comical highlight for me was one student moaning about university fees and saying "Some of my friends have had to get part-time jobs to afford their fees!"

      Another said that students shouldn't pay their fees because that's "unfair", "the government" should pay ... boo hoo hoo ... but where does "the government" get it's money from deary? The tax paying public, and a quarter borrowing ATM, so it's the rest of us and our descendants.

      1. Shakje
        Stop

        Indeed, but why stop there?

        Freeloading kids getting their education paid for by our taxes, let's get rid of public schools (educated in Scotland, I call them public and private schools) altogether, that'll stop students thinking they've got a right to free education when they leave school.

        I mean, why would we, as a country, want to support the intellectual development of our population? And who cares if they have to neglect their studies to work so that they can go to university at all, and end up with a poorer knowledge and degree because of it?

        I disagree with frivolous degrees as much as the next person, but you're being a dick.

      2. This post has been deleted by its author

    2. Volker Hett
      Coat

      Did you know ...

      that Harddisks are specified to operate as high as 3000m/9000feet?

      What with people living in some elevated region, the Andes come to mind.

      Friend of mine hat two hd crashes traveling by bus from Argentina to Bolivia.

      Mines the one with the mile high member card in the pocket.

      1. Happy Christmas

        3000 Metre Altitude Limit

        You'll find that most hard disks will not operate properly over 3000m altitude not just the ones in IPADs. Ask any trekker in the himalayas about the performance of his/hers laptop netbook. I've discovered this recently while visiting Tibet. My machine took ages to start up, and as for using photoshop forget it.

    3. Doug Glass
      Go

      Just a normal day to me

      Here in the sunny south we treat 35c (95F) as a cool snap. We've had several weeks this year that had temps past 100F (39c) and even a few sustained runs at 103+F (40c os so). Gotta be tough (or have a vested interest) to put up with this kind of heat, but once you get aclimated it give a whole new meaning to the phrase "when hell freezes over".

      Oh well, truth is most sensitive electronic gear needs to be kept cool and the good Lord knows Apple and The Sacred J are about as sensitive as they come.

  9. alex 39
    WTF?

    Just take it back if you don't iLike it

    This need to sue because a product slightly pisses you off drives me up the wall! As the youtube song says "if you don't like, it bring it back". The law already protects your consumer rights in this regard, why the need to sue?

    I haven't tried using my iPad outside, but i would imagine you can't see the screen in the sort of bright sunshine that gives rise to 35 degC anyway.

    1. Parsifal

      Kindle

      Funny the kindle works well in bright sunlight, its getting old apple claiming they are flawless and people are just using the device wrong, if this is true then apple have misled the punters, given that the device won't work in summer in the country it was designed in makes it just an expensive door stop.

      And that's the reason people like to dig at Apple, claiming your products are perfect and weaseling out of responsibility claiming the users are at fault for design problems and then putting spin on a 1/2 assed fix to a design problem.

  10. Adrian Esdaile
    FAIL

    NO! The right to sue is the AMERICAN WAY!

    Don't like the rain today? SUE THE WEATHER FORECASTER!

    Don't like the way your mouse picks up fluff? SUE APPLE!

    Don't like the way your teeth get cold when you have ice-cream? SUE THE ICE-CREAM MAKER!

    Here in Commonwealth lands, we just whine a bit.

    Legal action is the American way of whining. One of my favourite Americans, Jamie Hyneman, has the solution to this problem: "Go have a cookie."

    Your iPad getting too hot is telling you to go have a beer and/or cookie. If you are overly religious and believe beer to be the drink of the devil; I suggest you die, then complain to God in person, I'm sure he'll listen and provide you with free legal advice.

    1. Wallyb132
      Troll

      You almost got it right...

      'Don't like the way your teeth get cold when you have ice-cream? SUE THE ICE-CREAM MAKER!"

      Should read "Don't like the way your teeth get cold when you have ice-cream? SUE THE DENTIST!"

      Encouraging people publicly to sue ice cream makers is not socially acceptable, it will force the ice cream makers to unnecessarily raise the price of ice cream out of fear they might actually get sued. besides everyone knows its the dentist's fault, silly...

      "Legal action is the American way of whining. One of my favourite Americans, Jamie Hyneman, has the solution to this problem: "Go have a cookie.""

      That little quote is cute and all, but i think it misses the mark when trying to convey the proper sentiment in these sorts of situations.

      A more fitting and more appropriate response to these people in situations like this, comes from one of the funnier american, Eddie Murphy "Have a coke and smile and shut the fuck up!"

  11. Uwe Dippel
    Flame

    Come on, (fan-)boys!

    Seems you drool around on all tech sites these days to stonewall criticism of the second coming, our lord from Cupertino.

    NOW I know why the thing is so costly: as someone living in the tropics, on a local tropical salary, we simply can't afford the thing. And for good reason so, since temperature tends to rise well above the decreed level.

    Sure, AC and alex39, consumer protection is one thing. But when you drive it into the corner that you project, we all will spend our money, maybe even on credit, go and buy stuff that fails left and right, and once it does, we may return it. That - to me - is a horrifying scenario. At least I have better things to do with my time, than buying stuff 'on test' and if they fail what they promised in the ad, my only remedy is, to drive back (on my own expenditure and time), to reclaim my money.

    I already hate the current avalanche of beta-software that works, or just doesn't. But at least it's free (in the sense of 'no cost involved'). But I would love to sue anyone who brings half-brewed shit to the market, and graciously refunds my money, when it actually turns out to be that: shit.

    1. Andy Jones
      FAIL

      Do what John?!

      Are you a moron or something? The consumer protectionlaws are to protect you, the consumer, from being ripped off by businesses. You may not realise it but businesses do not care about you, all they want is your money. If they can sell you crap they will sell you crap. If they can lie to you just to get you to buy something then they will damn well lie to you. Why? As stated, they just want your money - THEY DO NOT CARE ABOUT YOU.

      If you buy something and it does not live up to its promise, that the business said it can do this and that and it bloody well can't, then you are entitled to a refund.

      If you buy something and it turns out to be faulty then you are entitled to a refund.

      If you buy something and it breaks within the expected lifetime of the equipment, which in the UK is 6 years, then you are entitled to either the business fixing it for you or replacing it.

      If you find this a horrifying scenario, that you have the right to get a refund when a business rips you off through lies, or you have the right to get a refund or items fixed/replaced if they break within a certain period of time, then you are a complete and utter moron.

  12. Matthew Barker
    Headmaster

    Hmmm?

    Who the hell wants to sit in the sun in 95 degree weather and read. And electronic gadgets always have a limitation. I can dip a book in water and, as long as I fan out the pages, I can still read it when it's dry.

    My daughter's iPod shuffle went through the wash twice (at 800 rpm) and still works. Maybe I should sue Apple for a product that violates its environmental limitations.

    Probably the reg should start a US-only column modeled on "flame of the week", called "stupid class action lawsuit of the day". Make sure you put pictures and addresses of the folks bringing the lawsuit so we don't accidentally hire them.

    1. JohnG

      Who the hell wants to sit in the sun in 95 degree weather and read?

      My wife and any of my former girlfriends do/did exactly this on holiday: Lie on the beach or next to the swimming pool in a bikini, reading some book.

      1. Doug Glass
        Go

        Sippin' on some suds ...

        .. and sliding down into the shoals every now and then to get another sitting there cooling. Start that pig roasting early afternoon and wait for the alcohol to do it's job.

      2. Wallyb132
        Thumb Down

        I would love to sit in the sun in 95 degree weather and read...

        I would love to sit in the sun in 95 degree weather and read...Unfortunately thats not an option here. When the thermometer hits 95 here it usually occurs early in the morning, and doesn't make a stop, mother nature just honks the horn as the bus passes by!

        Here in Arizona, they like to say "But its a dry heat"... Bullshit! I'm sitting on my patio typing this, Its just after noon, and its balmy 102F (38C), humidity is 41%, winds from the east at 9mph (thats 15kph for you Brits), blowing just enough to give the effect of slow roasting in a convection oven. High today will hit 111F (41C) degrees with a 40% chance of afternoon showers and thunderstorms.

        95 Degrees would feel like paradise right about now.

        This lawsuit does explain one thing tho, it explains why the ipad isnt widely popular here in arizona, even if we werent in a state of economic crisis, i doubt the people here would buy an overpriced seasonal device.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Brits use mph

          A message is required

    2. Doug Glass
      Go

      Dude!!!

      95F is just a walk in the park. We in the sunny south have long known how to deal with it. Get yourself a hot woman and trust me, everything else will be a cool breeze.

  13. Terry Kiely
    Badgers

    iTent

    I can see the website now~~~

    claim here within 30 days to receive your free iTent. If you have already purchased one we will refund etc... etc...

    Badgers 'cos they know to stay in their hole when it gets hot.

  14. Dagg
    Paris Hilton

    The Next Gen with wings

    I'll wait for the next generation that has wings. The wings will act as radiators to shed the extra heat. Paris cos she probably uses pads with wings.

  15. Geoinerworks

    Idiots

    Ok I live in AZ, Scottsdale to be exact, and I sit outside all the time with my iPad where the temps reach over 100 in the shade. I am out there for an hour at a time or more and this never happens to mine. I think it's a bunch of shit!, my net book computer that has a 12hr battery life only lasts about 3 because every fan is running at full speed to keep it from over heating maybe I should sue!!!!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Thumb Up

      Arizona

      I live in Arizona as well, and in the hotest parts of the day my iPad is working just fine over duration. I hadn't ever heard this happens until I was just checking on current articles and ran across this one.

      What's the indication when it turns off it's due to thermal?

      Is there a specific message that pops up like "Shutting down device it's running too hot"?

      Just curious.

  16. JaitcH
    Jobs Horns

    Lemon 4: Now It's 12 Defects

    I guess this means that Lemon 4 communicators should be kept north of the Tropic of Cancer - the circle of latitude on the earth that marks the apparent position of the sun at the time of the northern solstice.- AND south of the Tropc of Capricorn - the circle of latitude on the earth that marks the apparent position of the sun at the time of the southern solstice.

    This makes the Lemon 4 ideal for northern residents of Canada, and Laplanders, where it is bloody cold and they wear gloves so there won't be antennae problems.

    Recall time?

    1. Lottie
      FAIL

      um

      Small difference between iPad and iPhone4.

      1. JaitcH
        Jobs Horns

        Difference between iPad and iPhone4?

        Not much - same defective OS and same crippled designs.

        1. Lottie

          True

          But combining the iPhone and iPad flaws together to make an argument is a little silly now isn't it?

          After all, bitching about aerial design on a device without said aerial? C'mon!

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      re: "Lemon 4: Now It's 12 Defects"

      God, you're predictable, Webster.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Zzz

      You're not as witty as you think you are, sir.

  17. Jah

    Its all to with the rubber case!

    The standard Apple case for the iPad is made of rubber and it is probably causing the iPad to over heat. Perhaps Apple should recall the rubber cases and offer refunds!

    (you could probably make 4 iphone 4 rubber cases from every iPad case!)

  18. Jim_aka_Jim
    Coat

    Temps

    "Operate iPad in a place where the temperature is between 0° and 35° C (32° to 95° F). Low- or high-temperature conditions might temporarily shorten battery life or cause iPad to temporarily stop working properly."

    Here in Hungary with blazing hot summers and freezing cold winters, that would mean I couldn't use the iWhatever outside for 4 months of the year. And if I didn't own aircon I couldn't use it at all during the summer months.

    That doesn't sound fit for use to me. Infact, it sounds crap. Can I sue Apple if I don't own an iPad?

    1. Volker Hett

      Do you own any other portable electronics?

      Notebook, digital camera, MP3 player etc.pp?

      Chances are, that they are specified in the same temperature range.

    2. Doug Glass

      Four Months???

      A/C comes on in early March and it stays on until early October. Makes for a fairly high power bill if your insulation is substandard, but we make up for that with Winters most people seem to call a cool summer day.

      And you don't have to shovel heat.

  19. Select * From Handle
    Joke

    Well that what you get.

    if you are a fanboi, who belives everything apple tells you... the next reg apple topic will be, people are suing apple because they are getting virus's on their macs...

  20. Velv
    FAIL

    Read the Specifications

    "Operate iPad in a place where the temperature is between 0° and 35° C"

    When all the hype was taking place I read the specifications page and thought "well there;s another good reason not to buy one"

    Now it could be argues that the UK rarely exceeds these, but sometimes it does (I'm in Scotland, we do cold!)

    But maybe a couple of times a year I go to popular places where it does exceed these limits (err, Apple - California!).

    So it's double fail:

    1. Trying to sue Apple if you exceed the operating limits

    2. Apple - for producing a pile of crap that doesn't work in normal regional temperatures.

  21. Bobajobbob

    Losers

    Professional predatory blackmailing extorting losers. The US is full of them. Forgedaboutit.

  22. Steve X
    Coat

    Fahrenheit 95

    Just doesn't have the same ring, somehow...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Flame

      "Book-paper catches fire at 451 degrees Fahrenheit"

      I think that might have been the first Bradbury novel I read. In spite of the title, it was chilling.

      Flames, obviously.

      1. Doug Glass

        Not Exactlym But Close

        451F is the temp at which book paper fire becomes self-sustaining. If will burn at a far lower temp, but below 451F if you remove the source flame, the fire extinguishes itself.

        1. Byte
          FAIL

          *whoosh*

          That would be the sound of you completely missing the point that I was quoting Ray Bradbury and his book Farenheit 451.

  23. rahul
    Thumb Down

    The only thing worse than Apple...

    ... are lawyers.

  24. Greg J Preece

    In fairness to the iPad

    Don't most consumer electronics come with a warning not to leave them in direct sunlight? I remember back in t'day, when I holidayed in Spain, the Discman had to stay under the sun lounger.

    1. Tony Smith, Editor, Reg Hardware (Written by Reg staff)

      Re: In fairness to the iPad

      Indeed. Every piece of consumer electronics I have ever bought over the past 30 years has had 'don't leave in direct sunlight', 'don't leave on your car's dashboard or under the rear screen' because they will overheat. Why should the iPad be any different? Answer: it isn't.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        The iPad should be different because

        I keep getting told in their ads that the iPad is 'magical', 'revolutionary' and 'does everything a book does' in rather loud voices, so why the hell should have to wade through all the small print just to find out that it is actually none of those things. If the ads weren't so patronizing and misleading I wouldn't be bothered in the slightest that a perfectly ordinary computer worked like a perfectly ordinary computer

      2. david bates

        And how does that work

        for your GPS, which presuamably spends much of its time stuck on the windscreen probably in direct sun.

        I think the issues you're talking about are leaving things in closed cars in the sun, where temperatures can be spectacular. You dont expect electronics to quit just beacause the weather is a bit warm.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          GPS

          No it doesn't... Even the GPS comes with standard operating temps.

          Aside from the fact it would get stolen, only the cradle is left on the windscreen in direct sunlight (even that is sometimes removed to hide the fact that its there).

          A dashboard can get extremely hot for a parked car. Even using a foil windscreen cover doesn't dissipate the heat much.

          When you are driving you'd have the aircon/fan/windows open to keep the car cooler and the windscreen wouldn't be in direct sunlight all the time.

      3. Tom 13

        It may be no different than any other piece of electronic kit,

        but that also means Apple need to not claim otherwise in their advertising. I'm pretty sure this one would be open and shut if called before your UK false advertising board. The only bit that makes it more interesting in the US is they bring out the roulette wheel to spin for damages (of course the lawyers do fleece most of it out of their marks, I mean clients before they leave the casino).

      4. Arctic fox

        Agree.....

        .......110%. This is bloody stupid. I am NOT impressed with Jobs' kit but this is flaming ridiculous.

      5. Parsifal

        Forget Fairness

        Its advertised as being able to go anywhere with you, if it can't then apple are using false advertising to sell a product, probably their spin doctor lawyers didn't read the advertising text well enough.

  25. DEAD4EVER

    ipad overheating

    haha go on sue them maybe it will make them think twice for messing with customers instead of been honest and upfront saying ok its got a overheating issue send it to your nearest store for a replacement sir no probs il do that sir. but no apple wants to do the sh sh thing keeping numb and quiet and you wonder why apple is so exspensive haha il never buy a apple in the future theres plenty of alternatives out there for me to choose from and cheaper.

    1. Geoff Campbell
      Unhappy

      What a very strange person.

      Could you perhaps learn to write in a way that can be understood? I'm no grammar Nazi, but I have yet to see a single message from you that I can glean any sensible meaning from, even after re-reading many times.

      GJC

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Stop

        The title is required, and must contain letters and/or digits.

        He probably posted it off his iPad and couldn't figure out how to include punctuation. Or just wanted to get his message across before it crapped out in the heat.

        What -- he doesn't have an iPad? He must just be a moron then.

  26. Luke McCarthy

    Sunlight

    You can't read the screen in direct sunlight anyway.

  27. This post has been deleted by a moderator

  28. Captain_Aluminium
    FAIL

    Demographic fail?

    This amuses me greatly, after reading the piece yesterday on iPad owners being ruthless, unpleasant elitists; how could Apple not expect to be sued by that demographic?

  29. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    what the hell?!

    This is absolutely bleeding pathetic! Everything is like ''if you don't like it, sue em'' approach. Report it to Apple if it overheating, get your money back (and compensation for your time), simple!

    If the operating temperatures is not in the range for the city you live it, well tough shit, you should have read the specifications before buying!

    @ Tony Smith

    Yes, pretty much every consumer electronics comes with operating temperatures. Just because it excel in this area designed by the manufacturer and people take this for granted, doesn't mean you completely ignore the warnings. You risk doing so at your own expense, not the manufacturer.

    If you are in a country where the temperatures is below 0 degree centigrade and/ or above 35 degree centigrade, then make a request to Apple, not buy it and then sue them for their own specification that you didn't bother to read!

  30. hahnchen

    How can you even see the screen in direct sunlight?

    In the battle between LCD readability, and the sun, the sun has won every time.

  31. Volker Hett

    We had a couple very hot days

    and my iPad worked just fine in as much direct sunlight I could stand with some 35°C, which I didn't expect after the first reports.

    With this said, if it would switch off too often, I'd just return it. Is the US so different from germany that one has to sue over this?

  32. Lamont Cranston
    Pint

    The more sensible solution, I assume,

    would be to obtain a refund from the vendor, then report Apple to whatever the US equivalent of the ASA is?

    Suing is obviously the default position for the US consumer - good luck to them!

  33. Richard 118
    Jobs Halo

    Because..

    Because no other computer has recommended temperature operating recommendations does it?

    http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c01998025.pdf

    Operating Temperature 0-35 degrees

    http://support.euro.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/vos3300/en/SM/specs.htm

    Operating Temperature 0-35 degrees

    1. TkH11

      @Richard 118

      This is BS! Just because a computer doesn't specify an operating temperature range does not mean to say it will work in any temperature.

      In fact, if you read my other post - when the mod's publish it - you'll soon realise why what you said was BS and why it simply is not possible for a computer to run in all temperature conditions.

      Here's some further information.

      The temperature affects the performance of the chip. During the design stage, the designers will select a temperature range (of the chip that is,not the ambient temp) over which they want the chip to run. They will carry out logic simulations using different delay multipliers for the logic gates to simulate the effect of temperature.

      Typically, 3 simulations will be conducted, min, typ (typical), max.

      These simulations take into account of the temperature range and supply voltage variation over which the chip should expect.

      The chip is laid out, logic gates place and routed (connected). And another set of simulations is conducted post-layout taking in to account the actual physical layout properties (capacitance, resistance).

      Therefore, fundamentally, the operating temperate range of the consumer product is determined by the design of the integrated circuit chips.

      The idea that a computer, an electronic device will work over a very wide temperature range is quite simply laughable. They have to be designed to work over that temp range and there's a very significant cost factor.

      The issue is that that silicon chips are semiconductor devices, and the electrical properties (extrinsic carrier densities -electrons and holes) are strongly dependent on temperature).

      In fact, it's precisely because of this temperature dependency that often, semiconductor devices are used as temperature sensors, - if correction is made for the non-linear temp.response.

  34. Basic
    FAIL

    Fail

    Personally, I really dislike apple but even I can't get behind this lawsuit - overheating tech needs to shut down. If you leave something in direct sunlight, it can get hot.

    2 + 2 = 4

    1. Arctic fox

      I have (as some will have noticed) contributed.......

      .......some postings, now and then, which Jobs' fanbois would regard as somewhat unfriendly. However on this issue I absolutely agree with you. Taking what is in practice a thin laptop out in pretty hot weather and expect it to cope is ridiculous. I am perfectly willing to blame SJ for original sin if I am feeling "sour" but there are limits and this court action appears to go way over the limits of practical common sense.

  35. Is it me?

    OMG

    You can't read an iPad in direct sunlight, the man is a genius, I would never have guessed, after all who would have thought that an electronic display device is difficult or impossible to read in direct sunlight, like TVs, CRTs, Digital Camera's, Mobile Phones, Plasma & LED displays.

    And the genius goes on, an iPad isn't just like a book, well, $&£^ me, a £500 electronic device isn't the same as a £4.99 paperback, his powers of observation just go on and on don't they. Next thing is he'll complain that he can't dry the iPad over the towel rail when he drops it in the bath, criminal I say.

    And a black device in sunlight heats up, well wouldn't of seen that one coming, would you? Oh wait Apple didn't.

    Well American's aren't happy unless they are shooting or suing someone, bless.

    1. DrXym Silver badge

      Where have you been?

      There are quite a number of displays which are visible in full sunlight. The most prominent would be e-ink devices, but there are LCDs too. The One Laptop Per Child device has a screen which can flick into a high contrast black & white display for sunlight viewing and the tech has been commercialized by Pixel Qi. I was actually surprised that the iPad didn't feature a Pixel Qi screen especially after being touted as a book reader.

  36. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    If your stupid enough to actually believe the sales blurb

    you deserve to waste money.

    When will people learn not to believe everything they hear?

  37. D@v3

    another consideration

    is that these people making the claim, as just so slow at reading, that when they are out in the sun, and have to squint a bit, it slows them down even more, and when they hit a page with a few long words on it, it takes them so long to read the page (and thus engage in input to turn the page), that the 'screen auto lock' function kicks in, due to lack of input.

  38. handy
    Alert

    Ok so long as its clear on the packaging

    Its fine them saying it does not work between those operational temperatures (which are frequently encountered), however that has to be clear on the the packaging. You should not have to buy product, then read the manual to find out it wont work outside.

    1. Volker Hett

      I checked my Canon 5D manual because of this thread

      Working temperature range is 0° to 40°C and that's stated on page 173 of the manual.

      What they don't tell, but its common knowledge to photographers, is that battery capacity drops in low temperatures, i.E. around 0°C I get some 50 shots out of one fully charged battery.

      That LiIon Batteries don't like high temperatures is well known, too.

  39. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    0-35C is OK for indoors equipment only....

    ....but not for a tablet which people buy expecting it to work outside as well. Operation in the shade up to at least 50C is expected for this class of devices. I design automotive electronics for a living, and -40C to 125C is common for products of comparable complexity to an iPad, and -25 to 75C is fairly trivial to do without pushing the cost through the roof.

    I may be going against the majority here, but 0-35C is the wrong design spec for for the object in question, and a lawsuit is the pretty much the only recourse under US law. When was the last time your (factory installed) car radio stopped working because you were listening to it in a parking lot, with the windows down, and it was hot outside? Why should the iPad be any different? If Jobs & Co. cannot design proper temp range electronics, at least they need to put a big warning sign "for use indoors only, in a temperature controlled environment" on each POS they sell.

    People may be looking at Apple ads and buying iPads for inventory control applications (no A/C in most warehouses, and temp easily goes above 50C in a warehouse in Texas, for example), reading on a beach under an umbrella or on your back porch in the summer, and at least they expect it to carry it around a briefcase (which may get to subfreezing temperatures in may places in 10 minutes or less during winter) without any special cooling or heating.

    Apple is not trying to sell the iPad for use indoors only, and their ads do not show people with iPads in climate controlled rooms - on the contrary, they emphasize the use on iPad outside in their advertising. A class action lawsuit serves them right, as far as I can see, for selling a product designed to the wrong spec for the intended (advertised) applications.

    1. TkH11

      temp ranges

      "and -25 to 75 is fairly trivial to do without pushing the cost through the roof".

      A partially valid point, but:

      1)you're talking cars, not consumer products. Consumer products are intended to be operated indoors in an environment which is comfortable for human beings.

      There's not much point in having an Ipad desiged to operate at a temperature of +50 C if the human being can't withstand that temperature!

      Human must be with IPad for it to work.

      So on first sight, the temperature range of 0-35 for an Ipad should be fine, most of the time in western countries. In Asia, the Middle East, where the ambient temperature hits 50 C, then there's a problem, but chances are you're not going to be sitting in 50C!

      The issue is obviously direct sunlight and its absorbtion, not the ambient temperature.

      You need to make a distinction between the two.

      2) How do you deal with the sunlight question, or in general, too high a temperature?

      Cool the device...put some forced cooling inside using a fan, say good bye to the battery life then! In sub zero, heat the IPad up? This is actually what some military products do, incorporate heaters in to the LCD screens to heat them up to bring them into their normal operating temperature range. Definitely kiss good bye to the battery life now!

      Could they have designed the chips, could they have produced an LCD panel which would run down to -25 and up to +70 and still keep a commercially viable product based on the cost?

      I doubt it, otherwise they would have.

      What Apple have done wrong, is to oversell the idea that the Ipad can go anywhere, and any electronics engineer knows it can't, unless it's been designed with that in mind, and it almost certainly wasn't because of cost factors, battery life, and other technical performance issues with possibly the screen.

      I know you know, but for the other readers here, battery life also depends on temperature.

      1. Sooty

        It's worth bearing in mind

        That a prolonged exposure to a 35ºC+ environment is not particularly survivable for a human either, so it seems fairly reasonable to put this as an upper limit for a casual device not really expected to be used in conditions much more extreme than a boardroom.

        Remember, even if you live in a country that gets to higher temperatures, you, yourself, will be keeping your temperature down through various means. Ipads cannot thermoregulate as well as we can, they cannot sweat, or drink, to bring their temperature down! Should your core body temperature ever reach 40º, which isn't much higher, you will in extremely serious danger of dying there and then!

  40. Willum08
    FAIL

    No surprise

    Just another piece of crap in a long list of crap produced by the 'i' firm.........

    1. Arctic fox

      I REALLY do not like Axxxx but your post is....

      .......full of the same you accuse Axxxx of.

  41. Anonymous Coward
    Joke

    I hereby patent...

    The full aluminum-copper, fully insulated and fully sealed IPad case with heatpipes, heatsinks and a coated glass front for use in direct sunlight, with solar powered heat exchange system for just $1299,95. Cooling fluids are guaranteed CFC free.

    Comes with floats for swimming pool and oceanic use. IPW 65 compliant.

    Optional solar charger connector for the IPad. Optional battery pack for heat exchange system operation during warm nights. Weighs only 4,5 kg.

    I present you: the IRuggedPad.

    Also in bulletproof version.

    FAIL.

  42. Keris

    "Not fit for purpose"

    Does US sales law include that phrase? Regardless of what the fine print says about the operating temperature range, in the UK if a device does not work in the situation for which it was bought it can be returned for a refund as "not fit for purpose". Up to at least 2 years later (could be more in some cases).

  43. Avatar of They
    Thumb Up

    To be honest,

    The advert is lots of people looking at it out doors, but they are sitting under a shade for the most part. Granted the voice over is shite, and the people are holding it correctly.

    Thing I never understood having played with an ipad for a bit. It is heavy and you can't read it like a book unless you rest it on your knees, and then they get too warm because the thing generates a lot of heat. That was in sunny north UK, where we are having downpours most days. Add some sunlight and the things must toast.

    Still gotta' love Americans.

  44. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    hot iPads ? Brings back memories

    ooooooh - remember the random shut down problems on the original MacBooks ?

  45. Ted

    Ice Cream

    I took an Ice Cream cone out in the sun one time, and it freki'n MELTED!!!

    I going to sue those bastards for making a faulty product!

    1. TkH11

      @Ted, Ice cream

      We had such a hot day here the other week, I was really impressed, the ice cream was melting just as fast as I could lick it! And that doesn't happen very often here..

  46. Guido Esperanto
    Headmaster

    To paraphrase Steve Hughes the comedian

    When did common sense stop being so common?

    "its 35+ degrees in the open and you are in the shade and your ipad is working, how did that happen?"

    "Because I'm not a moron"

    I'm not Apple lover, but if you categorically believe the blurb spouted by the elves from the magic box you deserve to be labelled stupid.

    "My Bugatti Veyron didnt do 200mph,..your ad said it can do 200mph....I'm gonna sue"

    "Did you put petrol in it?"

    "Nope"

    "Well you're an idiot"

    Lets have away with all this frivolity. Lets get back to some basics.

    You buy a product on the merit of a campaign, you RTFM, you operate in normal conditions, it works, you win, yay for you.

    You buy a product on the merit of a campaign, you RTFM, you operate in normal conditions, it doesnt work, you take it back for refund you win, yay for you.

    everyone stays happy and the lawyers will be down the soup kitchen at Christmas :D

  47. MegC

    Hmm....

    I'm waiting for the lawyer to ask them if they feel they should be able to use it in the middle of a monsoon and if not why they feel other weather conditions should be exempt from such common sensical ideals.

    That said, buy a parasol ¬¬

  48. Lloyd
    FAIL

    If you wanted a device that works......

    Then why on earth did you buy an Apple? Buy a laptop/tablet for 50% of the money and get Flash thrown in for free.

    1. Volker Hett

      Not with Intel CPUs

      they switch off when they overheat. Had that a couple of times when we had some nice weather here. 30°C in the office, 65°C in the computer case.

      One TM2 Tablet died a prematurely death, it didn't turn on after it cooled down :(

  49. TkH11

    Temperature Specification

    The operating temperature range of 0-35 deg. C. is not unreasonable.

    Years ago I used to be an integrated circuit chip designer. 3 temperature ranges were offered: Commercial, industrial and military.

    I can't recall the exact temperature ranges, I think commercial was 0-70C, the military spec was the widest of all going down to something like -40 and up to +125 deg. C. Note, this is the operating temp of the chip, not the ambient air temperature.

    if you use a comercial chip and try to put into freezing temperatures, then it's not going to work.

    So many of you seem to want the device to work in sub zero and work in very hot conditions too.

    The only way you can acheieve that is by using military grade/spec'ed chips and these are a) designed to work over the wider temperature range, b) burned in, c) more extensively tested.

    Companies don't put military grade chips into a consumer product for one very good reason: price.

    A major element in the manufacturing cost of a chip is the time to test it. The price of these chips is many many times higher than the same chip with the commerical temp specification.

    Manufacturers do not use mil spec chips in consumer products because said product would e so f**ng expensive, Joe Public wouldn't buy it.

  50. Ed Cooper

    Oh for lord sakes

    Do you really expect any manufacturer of a consumer goods item to post operating temperatures of, what, -20C to +50C ambient. Absolutely no chance, wide temp spec kit costs serious money, batterys, lcds, digitisers are all majorly affected by temperature.

    That's why silicon companies make special lines of their chips for the automative market, and charge a hefty premium for them.

  51. Anonymous Coward
    Flame

    I just can't be bothered

    ...I can't be bothered reading the numerous posts from Apple-haters on here.

    You may have noticed that only THREE people have reported the problem. How many iPads have been sold? So that's a ratio of one in ... ?

  52. James O'Brien
    WTF?

    And this is exactly why...

    "'[r]reading on iPad is just like reading a book.' However, contrary to this promise, using the iPad is not 'just like reading a book' at all since books do not close when the reader is enjoying them in the sunlight or in other normal environmental environments."

    I prefer the tactile feel of a TRUE book. Plus if the company you bought the book from they cant arbitrarily remove said book if they fucked up on the copy right. *cough Amazon 1984 incident anyone?*

  53. lemon

    enjoy iPad

    Is it human stupidity or rather cupidity ? I would not know, but anyway, the iPad works fine for me in Japan where the sun luminosity reaches 18,000 lux. Although besides the sun, the sand is more armfull to the iPad, I was on the beach recently with my iPad and no problem.

    But then common sense would indicate that any electronic device should be reasonnably kept away from intense heat source, unless of course you are looking for an excuse to get big bucks from a reputable company like Apple using class action.

    Now with the 9.7-inch LED-backlit glossy widescreen display, 1024-by-768-piexl resolution, the HD feature makes watching DVD movies an utterly new experience, Im just considering to go vacation to Hawaii with the iPad and iPad video Converter from ifunia to enjoy the top summer movies:

    http://ifunia.com/articles/getting-top-summer-movies-on-your-iphone4-ipad.html

  54. Raspy32

    @Adrian

    'Don't like the way your teeth get cold when you have ice-cream? SUE THE ICE-CREAM MAKER!"

    I'd say it's the consumers fault for not asking for warm ice-cream, but then I'm the sort of person who finds it natural to assume that a cup of coffee is hot, an ice-cream is cold and that not watching where I walk might result in me falling over.

    As for the iPad, I don't know where my loyalties lie on this one - after all I detest the "sue everyone" sort of people, but then the adverts (certainly the UK ones I've seen) do clearly show the iPad being used outside and not in a shaded area. So if it's not capable of doing this for an extended period then I would suggest they should be forced to change their adverts to reflect the fact.

    But then, not owning an iPad, I can't claim to know if it is a general issue or just a minor complaint from a small number of device owners.

  55. Colin Ritchie
    Paris Hilton

    I'm with Al on this one.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09I4Mi5IUl4

    Why Paris? Cos she gets hotter when the sun comes out and doesn't work either. :)

  56. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "Reasonable Expectations"

    A lot of people seem to be concentrating on the fact that the user manual says that you shouldn't use it above ambient temperatures of 35 centigrade. What matters in law however is not what it says in the manual, but whether it is reasonable for the user to expect the device to work above that temperature. The thing is that you don't get to read the manual until after you've bought the device. The "don't sue, just take it back" response is a crock in this case. Lets say I drove 100 miles to buy my iPad, paid for parking and then on getting it home read the manual and thought "no good for me". So I had to drive another 100 miles back to the store to return the device. Would Apple compensate me for my travelling and parking expenses, would they compensate me for my wasted time? They would not. That's why you may want to sue.

    If your car's manual came with such a stipulation would you think that was reasonable? Hey it's summer, I'd better leave the car at home and take the bus!

    But the point here seems to be that Apple lie, not only in their advertising but in their manual. It seems that even if the ambient temperature remains below 35 degrees, but the sun shines directly on the iPad it still shuts down. Does it say "don't use your iPad in the sun" in the manual? It does not. Is it reasonable to expect that you should be able to use your iPad in the sun?

  57. Prag Fest
    Dead Vulture

    I sigh

    So now we have the usual buffoons criticising Apple for making devices that should ideally be operated within the typical commercial temperature range. What happened to this site?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I sigh

      The site? Surely we are blameless here!

  58. Henry Wertz 1 Gold badge

    why doesn't it thermal throttle?

    title says it all. For reading, it would just not matter if it "turns the page" a little slower when it's hot. Much better than shutting down!

  59. David McMahon
    Dead Vulture

    Oi

    It's hard work being an Apple hater here! Please Slow down the stories!

    I think one piece of Apple news a week is quite enough!

    I have no more sarcasm to contribute, I am beaten!

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