"Jobs noted that the iPhone 4 has 78 per cent on the iPad's pixels "in the palm of your hand.""
Say what you like about the product, but you have to admit Jobs is a pure hype-machine/salesman/charlatan (delete as appropriate)
Steve Jobs has introduced the next-generation iPhone, prosaically known as the iPhone 4. This wasn't unexpected, but the Apple chief did reveal a number of features not mentioned in pre-release leaks. Jobs unveiled the handset at the company's Worldwide Developer Conference in San Francisco, and since the man won't actually …
While 720p HD is pretty common now, the fact you can edit it on the phone, add transitions and then upload it somewhere is pretty impressive.
Those who might moan about the video calls working only on Wifi might actually think about why this is. Firstly this isn't your usual 3G video calling, that was designed when screens were quite low resolution and video compression wasn't hardware assisted. Apple have come up with a much better quality video call system, they're making it a standard and it will be available for others to implement.
Secondly, Wifi is more available than the reception required for 3G video calls. You can do it at home or at a hotspot. I for one haven't a chance in hell of ever using 3G video calling where I am, yet I have a nice fast cable connection to the internet.
Nice kit but still a disappointment and you're right about video-conferencing needing bandwidth - I reckon quite a few access points would struggle with it as wel. But a new system?
Lots of people know all about video-conferencing system but Cisco's TelePresence has already set the standard and someone who knows network infrastructure would have to be involved in any roll-out. But who really uses video-conferencing? It was fun to play with 15 years ago on NetPhone and stuff but the novelty soon wore off and hasn't returned.
Now for the disappointment - why isn't it 3D? As noted in the piece on the new Motorola phone - adding a flash and second camera and microphone doesn't really count as innovative any more. Apple has definitely passed the baton to HTC and others on this but will still make a lot of money from this. Thing is, what's next? And will Apple be the company to show us?
Ah, you're missing one critical point here. You may live in an area with non-existant 3G, but I live in more high-tech city where we actually have working 3G with few deadzones. Can you walk from your apartment/flat/house to your local shop, buy a bottle of milk and walk back without losing your wifi signal? No? So then how is wifi more readily available than 3G?
When comparing old solutions with new solutions the biggest factor is "Does it work". If the old solution works over 3G but the new solution doesn't, who cares about quality. It just doesn't work. I want video chat over 3G just like I want voip over 3G. If it doesn't work I don't care about it.
Video calls cost more than 3G calls. Who wants to 3G video call with it's low resolution? I don't know the specs for video calling (I can't find them) but I would imagine it is 320x240 to 640x480 at best.
Since this system is sent over the data connection it would be a little unfair of Jobs to allow that without letting the networks prepare for it.
As for the question about "can you make calls to other phones", not yet, but Apple will publish it as a standard and then anyone can use it. Which is a damn sight more than Microsoft ever did (MSN Messenger webcam standard has never been released, it had to be reverse engineered).
I'm disappointed by the lack of a storage upgrade, I can fill my 160GB iPod Classic, so 32GB will be full in no time at all. I suppose they didn't want to make the iPad look bad by releasing a phone with the same amount of storage as the top-end model.
Still, looking forward to upgrading from my aged iPhone 3G, it's still a great phone but browsing seems to be getting very slow these days...
My media library was a couple of terabytes last time I checked, manage perfectly well on my 16gb phone. Have a core music selection and then a random playlist which shuffles music in or out.
Doubt a 3 or 4tb portable device would be cost effective and fit in the pocket as easily
with both Apple and Google working on "cloud-based" streaming solutions, there will be no need to carry copies of your media files around with you.
Google have hinted that their solution will be launched with the next release of Android, and from the demos, it will be like everybody having their own private Spotify. I think some people expected Steve Jobs to unveil the Apple version last night - maybe it isn't quite ready for primetime just yet.
Maybe it isn't music and video that eat your mobile storage...but they accounted for the bulk of mine until recently.
Besides, how long ago was it that 32GB on a phone or SIM card seemed unattainable? Rest assured there are fine minds at work on either giving you 1TB on your phone, or developing technology to make huge local storage unnecessary.
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Finally the iPhone that should have been launched in 2007 is announced... With the hardware that an N95 (launched in 2007) has...
Wee another maimed product at launch from Apple...
Hopefully in 2013 they'll launch the iPhone with a 10Mp camera with xenon flash, have unlimited multi-task, Adobe Flash and everything all the other announced phones of today have...
Whilst I agree this should have been the spec of the phone 3 years ago, the N95 was a dogs dinner of pooh! The most evangelical iphone converts I know are all ex N95 owners!
I've been waiting for the phone to have this spec since I came very close to owning a Motorola A1000 back in 2005. Only 3's rubbish garden wall internet and the pain of owning another Motorola handset put me off.
Even that had a video calling that "You can switch to the front camera". Poor show apple!
The resident Apple fan here is deeply disappointed - hoping for a 64gig model. Oh well... as the ipod cant be replaced with an iphone of sufficient capacity it also means the N86 wont be replaced. I have to admit as a disinterested bystander - more media capacity would have seemed to be a bigger seller than a three-axis gyroscope or even a forward facing camera that can only be used for calls in very limited circumstances.
I feel that this launch is diminished by a lack of focus on everyday practicality in favour of toys that very few users will actually benefit from. Im sure the more dedicated fans will disagree but then here Apple fan has spent much time extolling the usability and function of Apple products, only to see those arguments torn down by the bewildering inclusion of toy of limited usefulness.
technically this is correct, this is exactly why when you drop glass it tends to break, and when you drop plastic it doesn't
Not exactly the sort of thing I'd want the majority of the case made out of? What's wrong with the macbook approach of machining the thing out of a block of aluminium, with suitable adaptations for getting signals in and out.
"""What's wrong with the macbook approach of machining the thing out of a block of aluminium, with suitable adaptations for getting signals in and out."""
The MacBook is a pretty poor example of something that signals can get in and out of. Wifi reception is pretty poor compared to most laptops I've used, and it's noticeably directional, based on how much of that lovely Aluminum is between the antennas and the access point.
I can tell you that there is glass you can throw at a concrete floor without breaking it. You can even buy cups and plates made from it. It must be about 20 years ago that someone demonstrated this for me and I was very much impressed by it. Imagine a plate of glass just wiped off the table jumping and tumbling over the floor right against the other wall without breaking.
No, you can have glass you can hardly shatter even if you try hard, really.
Apple could sell turds if they polished them up, made a funky ad.
iTurd - has a little bit of a 'ring' to it!
Apple cashing in again on what is no doubt no real improvement - the only way they could improve the iPhone is if Apple were a little bit more open and stopped being so anal about the apps and code they approve, and, like. Sooner or later, Android on well designed pretty handsets will be the death of the iPhone.
Just look at the craze over the HTC Desire..
so we know what spec the iphone will now be for the next 18 months, and its only going to be 3G, 5mp camera. The only real selling point is better motion sensor.
Compare to what HTC already has out there with the EVO (4G, 8mp camera) - seems the iphone is out of date before its on the shelf.
Then the real killer - HTC seem pushing out new better phones every 3 months. So potentially HTC/android will be 6 generations ahead by the time the iphone 5 is near.
seems like the end is near for the iphone era.
Erm, I think you'll find that Apple release hardware update yearly.
What is the point of having 4G (outstanding battery life on the EVO, just awesome) if it is't going to be fully available for at least another 3 years? Shit, the 3G networks struggle to cope with the increase in traffic as it is.
Elementary physics will inform you that the amount of pixels on a sensor is only a measure of the image size, not the quality; for that you need a decent lens.
It has taken 'til about 6 week ago for Android devices to really surpass the iPhone, and it'll be at least 10 month before it'll happen again.
Seems to me that your hubris is as short lived as your iPhone prediction is...
"Elementary physics will inform you that the amount of pixels on a sensor is only a measure of the image size, not the quality; for that you need a decent lens."
Actually the number of pixels does relate to the quality, and not in the way you expect. After a while the craze of upmanship produces a sensor with photosites so small the amplification has to be cranked up to see in even moderate light. The more amplification the more noise. More than 4 or 5 megapixels on the tiny sensors they have in phones is pretty pointless.
At least Apple have finally put a flash of sorts on the damn thing, I was getting fed up of facebook pictures ("uploaded from my iphone") of silhouettes!
So at last it's caught up with my old N95... Assuming it has a good lens of course. Mine says Carl Zeiss.
Now we just have to see if this new gift from the gods can actually make it past 4pm without crawling crying to a power socket.
The noise level of an image is a function of the sensor's size.
The detail level of an image is a function of the pixel count.
The dynamic range decreases as pixels get smaller, but not by as much as you'd expect.
All other things being equal, more pixels are a good thing. Especially when in this case the pixel size hasn't changed, so the sensor has become larger. Image noise will therefore have decreased, since the "size" of the noise is now decreased relative to the size of the image.
The "quality" of an image is a function of both of these properties, and of the lens. The tiny lenses used in these things aren't very difficult to make. It is not uncommon to find numerous models in the digital camera world, with widely varying pixel counts.
So we're in the realm of people who decide that the better thing is whichever has bigger numbers or more ticks in a table. Even playing that game, compared to the Evo the new iPhone has a higher pixel density, a faster processor (per the experience of the iPad), faster Wifi and, quite probably, a better GPU.
Of the two devices, it's also the one that can play Grand Theft Auto, Street Fighter 4, Call of Duty, etc. Sorry if I've strayed a bit too far into things consumers actually care about with this paragraph.
Have to work with the carrier to get video calling working?
Oh, let me guess... The US networks can't do that yet either... Honestly... Of all the countries to develop your mobile device in, USA must be the worst! It's not wonder the SMS/MMS support was so bad when the first iPhone arrived, and continues to be a bit sub standard (but pretty).
I assume those of us in more advanced countries will have working video calling out of the box?
As a group, GAMES! What does iPhone 4 introduce? A proper 6 axis controller!
Simply a win. Sheer genius of focusing on your core market.
All the rest is just updating hardware to slightly ahead of the pack based upon what's available in the marketplace. Worthwhile, but nothing unexpected.
But a 6-axis controller and the APIs to use it, will sell an AWFUL lot of games. Happy devs, happy users, happy Apple at a 30% cut. (N.B. - the 30% cut of the App Store revenue really might make Apple work hard to create hardware that will move apps...)
Steve hasn't copied HTC, Moto, or Nokia. He has copied _Nintendo_, and stolen a march on the competition, once again.
I skipped the 3GS, but I'll be lined up for one of these on the 24th...
I haven't watched the vid, but I'm massively sceptical about the advantages of this gyro.
Sure, it'll be a more accurate motion sensor (hands up who thought that there was a problem before?), but it can't possibly be Wii-esque as you need to see the thing you're holding in order to know what action you're performing.
You can't really have a reasonable (e.g.) tennis game, as after every swing you need to move the screen back in to a viewable position.
Or have I missed something?
how Jobsian that apple *requires* the correct environment for its phone ...
* Operating temperature: 32° to 95° F
(0° to 35° C)
* Nonoperating temperature: -4° to 113° F
(-20° to 45° C)
* Relative humidity: 5% to 95% noncondensing
* Maximum operating altitude: 10,000 feet (3000 m)
and isn't 35° C a tad on the cool side ? I mean, wouldn't the thing just cook in my pocket on a hot (for u.k.) day ?
A: All manufacturers have such specs. My Wii, for example, and my Nokia E-series as well.
B: The operating temp is the one you want - and you won't be operating it in your pocket. After all, it's an iPhone so you will want everyone to see it. It'll be on your ear. Plus, they always build in some tolerance with t'specs.
C: I've lived in the UK and it would have to be a super hot day to reach 35 degrees. You guys take your shirts off at the first hint of sun and you're swimming in fountains at 25 degrees. However, in San Diego, anywhere in Australia and many other places besides, 35 will be a worry. More of a worry for the UK (and I don't mean this in a mean way) is the 0 degrees minimum operating temperature. It will be happy in your pocket then, but too many phone calls outdoors in the winter and it just might give up and hibernate.
WTF!? Surley we must be missing something, those can't be the realistic temperatures? Maybe they are a "cover my arse" statement?
I've lived in Germany and Poland - both of which can easily spank the minimum operating temps AND then occasionaly the non-operating temps. More recently, i've done six months in South Africa and that can regularly go over the operating temp and even on rare occasion the non. Back in London, in winter the minimum will get passed frequently!
Really? If you travel and want to USE the phone, you cannot seriously buy it with these limits. Even turned off, its at a serious risk.
It does amaze me how the appletinis quickly toss the old version for the new version because it’s apple. Yes of course no one ever quickly tosses a windows version because it’s windows.
I’ll be laughing 6 months from now they will be tossing the IP4 for the IP4a. The IP4 will be sitting right next to the old iPad because the new one will be out before Q1 2011 and the appletinis will be in line yet again continuing to pollute the planet with their e-waste..
For those who think the price of the now "old" phones will remain that high ... check it again in a few days. They know you will be selling and the price will drop faster than a bird covered it BP crude.
A quick check shows the 16Gb 3G still selling for around £250-300. That's about 12 months after the 3GS has launched.
In fact I remember looking last year after the 3GS launched and they were selling for £400-500 (sometimes more).
For some reason Apple phones are holding their second-hand prices quite well, like the Macs do. No idea why.
Good luck finding your bargain.
I strongly believe their will be a new one next summer. There was a new one last summer, and the summer before that. The thing is, if you want one, how long do you wait? I skipped the 3gs, coz i new the 4 would be en route, but do i now skip the 4, coz the 4a (or whatever) will be out next year. Next year, do i not bother with the 4a, coz its liekly that in 2012, the iPhone5 will be released. All the while, the iOS will be being upgraded, and my (very) out of date phone wont be able to take advantage of any of the new features.
Im throwing my hat in for an Iphone 4, and then probably the one after the next, a new phone every 2 years seems reasonable to me.
Yep, I reckon there'll be an update next year (iPhone 4 S probably) and then iPhone 5 in 2012, iPhone 5 S in 2013 and iPhone 6 in 2014.
My reasoning for this is that these days, the majority of contracts are 18-24 months long. The iPhone wasn't subsidised, so everyone was able to upgrade to the 3G when they wanted - which put most people (not all) on an 18-24 month contract. When the 3G S came out, it was just a minor update - enough to entice people who didn't have a 3G already and keep the iPhone relevant in the rapidly changing mobile market, but not enough to annoy people already locked in (well, a few people whined, but they obviously hadn't understood what a mobile contract means). There was no point doing anything major until all the iPhone faithful were out of contract and could afford to upgrade again - which is this year.
Then the cycle starts again.
I think AC is on crack. The number of mobile phone freaks who seem to have a new handset every couple of months astounds me.
iphone users probably churn hardware at a lower rate than average because Jobs simply doesn't turn out new models at the rate SE and Nokia do, so the lunatic fringe of gadget heads have to sit and wait, or jump ship.
And if skeletor has finally managed to deliver a smartphone with non-excremental battery life, I might have to finally succumb and join the collective, glad to see them actually emphasising a feature that is relevant. I think I have witnessed 1 person in my life ever attempting a video call, and I have yet to see a mobile phone camera that can match a 5MP Cyber-shot from 2003.
So when are HTC going to release their next handset? It seems to me that it's almost a weekly occurrence! Apple's hardware update schedule with the iPhone has been yearly and there is no reason to anticipate that changing in the nex year. It seem to me that while there are some fanbois out there (for *both* platforms), the sensible ones will skip a release. I didn't buy the 3Gs, but I'll be swapping my 2 year old iPhone (that I can sell to O2 for ~£200) for this new version.
You think upgrading when the latest handset comes out is exclusive to Apple? How silly, and given how seldom they release new handsets, even sillier.
BTW, your comment about pricing is not accurate either. I just sold my 2G iPhone with a scratched face for £130. The resale value of these phones is amazing!
"If it's over Wi-Fi, there won't be a charge...."
Of course you'll be able to connect directly to the other iPhone* of your choice. If this turns out not to be the case and there's an iChat service in the middle, Apple will of course give this away for free.
I admire your confidence........
*New Apple "standard" for video chat remember? What did you think you'd be connecting to?
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but I do like the prospect of something other than the shitty plastic that most phones cases are made from.
But then scrapes & gouges on anything I own upset me (sad isn't it)
Perhaps other manufacturers will follow suit in this case (unintended pun)
OK I'm going back to ignoring the Apple hype machine (I much prefer android)
Haha heard it has multi-tasking after a bit of research "the way its meant to be done" on apples website means that each application will stop working as you exit it for the next but then you can go back and continue from where you left off on the old. Kinda a guys way of multi-tasking but doesn't look like apple users are getting any of the cool programs that have to run in the background like what android has anytime soon.
@Anonymous Coward Did you stop reading at that bit? If you had carried on, you'd know that apps like skype (is that officially available for Android yet), spotify and other such apps will continue to function as expected. Nice try. Big FAIL though. HUGE
What about an app like settings profile lite, it runs in the background checking every 10 min on your position and will adjust the profiles (ring volume, wifi and many more) depending on location. If third party developers can actually have their apps run in the background that is multi-tasking if they just stop when your not looking at them then its just a pretty looking shortcut menu. happy to be corrected but it doesn't seem like the iphone has multi-tasking in the way every other device/computer does.
OS4 multitasking has several levels. At the most basic level, apps will pause when switching. For true multitasking, apps can register to use Core services that support multitasking. Oh noes, you can only multitask certain services! True, but the services are system level and efficient, as well as more secure than third party services would be, and better for your battery life too. In addition, apps that need to complete important non-service processes, they can register for time to complete the process in the background, so won't be paused (there is a time limit to this however).
Is what the press will say. Some real Star Trek tech there, laggy video phones..
Oh wait, we've had video calling for years, and years, but nobody ever uses it. Infact, my current handset (htc magic) doesn't have a front facing camera, but my old phone does (sony ericsson p990). When was it ever used? Once, with a friend sat next to me.
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But seems like a pretty good spec. However, with the number of people developing Android handsets (HTC are not the only ones you know) and the need to distinguish between manufacturers is likely to lead to a high development rate for new features for Android phones vs the single company Apple devices. The multiple source for Android phones WILL lead to a higher market share for the OS, and in turn a higher number of developers writing Apps for Android. Apple will need to keep up a high rate of development to compete in that arena.
And even putting that aside (and there's a nice article on Ars right now about why Android fragmentation isn't as bad as you think), when Android overtakes the iPhone it'll almost certainly do so by eating Symbian, BlackBerry and WinMo market share and by getting into the pockets of those same consumers. For many apps, the iPhone profit may remain higher than the Android profit even when the numbers are skewed in Androids favour, just as the stats from indie game makers are that they do 72% of sales to Windows users, 22% to Mac and 6% to Linux versus a 93% 6% 1% worldwide market split according to browser usage statistics. Apple's audience are more affluent and skewed towards entertainment products.
Besides, Apple have — since 2001 — produced substantial profit in two areas: being the foremost seller of MP3 players and being a niche seller of high value computers. The iPhone is somewhere in between and I don't see it going away even if it ends up more Mac than iPod.
I agree with your logic all the way up to your conclusion that more Android phones will lead to more developers. The problem is all the different handsets, which means coding to different hardware, different screens, etc. The nice thing about the iPhone is you can guarantee to write one app and it'll work on all the various flavours (which is one).
That worked out exactly as planned in the Linux arena.
I think that what you're missing is the fact that Apple don't normally compete in that arena and they don't look like they're about to start. They make products that appeal design-wise to their target demographic and they try to couple that with software that makes the device operate the way that their buyers expect, which may or may not be the way techies like us expect.
I'd say they have managed to hit their target almost dead on with the iPhone and if they're any kind of business at all they'll try to keep on hitting that target as long as it keeps paying out for them.
TBH, Nokia are the ones who should be most worried, they scatter-gun the market with products and now they're in a race to the bottom.
I think most people have overlooked the major selling point of the new iPhone - I'd imagine a lot of Facebook tards are wetting themselves this morning at the prospect of having Farmville on a mobile with "crop failure push updates", or whatever has been promised on this. Add the millions of Facebook/Farmville saddos to the list of iPhone wanters and hey presto, instant huge market.
That could actually be a fine way for controlling the population - plant a subliminal suggestion within iPhone Farmville to get the weak minded drones to carry out your bidding, instant super army of millions!
Pity poor Apple, it doesn't include video calling on its phones and everyone cries "Where's the video calling? I've had this on my Motorola since 1995?", so Apple listens to the consumers, adds video calling, and everyone cries "Why bother with video calling? I've had this on my Motorola since 1995 and never used it once"
Will this (presumably) over-priced, under-specced piece of crap have that any decent phone won't have? Come on now, even my Sony Ericcson (forget the model) had MMS 3 years before the Crapple iPhone came out. Get real people. It's shit. All of it. Who needs craps? (sorry, apps). What good is a fart button anyway if you can't make a decent phone call or send some pics to your mates?
Well, you've got it all figured out. To equal things out I just went over the Sony Ericcson fanboi forum and told everyone there how stupid they are, what crap devices they buy and use and consider useful, and how only *my* decisions in life are correct, everyone else is stupid, stupid, stupid.
When I left that forum I was on such a high - I feel so good about myself now.
I sold my iPhone 3G last week (they do hold their value remarkably well), but there was nothing in the iPhone4 announcements to get me to stick with Apple for my next device. The iPhone has been one of the best pieces of technology I've owned (second only to my TiVo), mainly because its just so easy to use (in fact it is genuinely a pleasure to use). However, the performance of the 3G was beginning to frustrate me a bit, along with the closed nature of Apple thinking.
So although I suspect the experience won't be quite as slick, I shall be swapping the rock-solid stabiility and beautiful software design of the iPhone for Android. Probably for the HTC Desire, which is pretty much on a par with Apple hardware-wise. And I hope Google will match iOS4 in terms of OS development and apps, and in a much more open way (although I'm under no illusions about Google's motives either).
The iPhone made (and continues to make) other phone manufacturers up their game, and long may that continue. But it's now time to move on...
Oh man, I knew this thread would be gold and it hasn't failed to deliver, Plenty of people moaning about the new iPhone but I for one can't wait for it! I use/used all of the phones mentioned so far on a pretty much daily basis and whilst alot of them had features still missing in the new iPhone the key point is that none of them are/were as pleasant or easy to use. This is the iPhone's strength, accessability, and this is the reason why I'd be surprised to see HTC or any other android handset overtake it in the near future. I also prefer Apple's tendancy to release new models on a yearly basis to that of their competitors who will release updated models on a bi yearly or even quarterly schedule, it means they actually end up supporting their products far more than everyone else.
For those asking "who uses video calling anymore"; deaf people do. Sign language works over mobile phones and even works on the old style 3G mobile video calls. In Sweden you can even make a call to a voice phone using a video call on a mobile through video relay service (with a BSL interpreter in the middle of the call).
And history should have taught us that many of these things don't take off until implemented on an Apple device. Symbian could run 3rd party programs and I had a version of Lemmings on my old phone but no-one cared until Apple "innovated" it. Soon you won't be able to move for iPhone fanboys holding the damn thing in front of them and shouting at it. Maybe that's one reason for the no-3G decision. Otherwise it'd be a muggers paradise.
Front facing camera and better resolution; So, major win for deaf people? It would be if you could use 3G for the connection and as long as Apple put in some kind of gateway in the network to let people connect to legacy mobile video codecs (unlikely knowing their business model).
I'm generally an Apple hater (biased by the PR and the preference of form over function) but it looks like a good phone. I just hope it still seems that way when the news of all the things Apple have crippled to protect their business model come out.
And that battery life of an iPhone isn't that much worse then the battery life of most other smart phones it's just that Apple users generally have everything running. If you turn off functions til you need them (like GPS) it will last a lot longer.
I couldn't help think that if the videophone and internet performance was so flaky in a room Apple must surely have loaded up with access points and made sure there was ample bandwidth beforehand, it'll be terrible in the real world, and maybe Jobs's slightly panicky demands for everyone to switch their wifi off were a sign that he realises this. I could be wrong, of course. Thinking of how bad wifi performance often is in hotels (surely one of their target users of such technology is the travelling employee wanting to phone home) in my experience it could be as bad as video calling was back when I had a Sony Ericsson K800.
As for the rest of the new features I personally didn't see anything to make me prick up my ears and consider getting one. I mainly use my phone as a phone, you see, so all this talk of HD video editing and so many more pixels was frankly a little wasted on me. Granted, there are people who will find a need for these features, but when I look around the train each morning and see dozens of people prodding at their iPhones they seem to be texting, playing music, or surfing the net rather than anything else, so although the phone will doubtless be a hit with the "it's Apple so I NEED IT" crowd (and I can't help but think that if the exact same phone had been made by, say, Samsung this thread would have had a tenth as many posts on it and the launch wouldn't be in the BBC news site headlines) but how much will they really use those features?
Still, it looks pretty. I'm staying elsewhere though - my current handset does everything I need, ta.
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