back to article Israelis develop Nazi-doodlebug sonic deathwave cannon

Israel intends to offer for export one of its latest and most terrifying military technologies: a sonic cannon or "thunder generator", powered by devasting "bunker buster" fuel-air explosive technology - used in secret Nazi superweapons of the 1940s - to deliver sound rays so powerful as to be instantly deadly to anyone hearing …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Alert

    Excuse me but...

    "Apparently, the frightful sonic shockwave raygun is "safe and simple to use", and "menial labourers" can be trained to handle it in less than 30 minutes."

    Is that short-hand for "UK police forces will dish them out like sweeties and use them for trivial offences like littering"?

  2. ravenviz
    FAIL

    Missing the point again

    How much does it cost to develop, deploy and run this technology to scare birds, surely the "menial labourers" could just cut out the middleman as live scarecrows?

    1. Carcass
      Thumb Up

      Real Life Usage

      In Paso Robles, Napa and Sonoma in California, vineyards use these as a bird deterrent. Given the acreage involved, it's a lot more effective than having migrant labor running around trying to scare birds (followed closely by Republicans trying to scare the migrants).

  3. MinionZero
    Unhappy

    If its "lethal inside 10 metres"...

    i.e. "could be lethal" inside 10 metres, but that if used as intended outside 30 metres' range it should cause no permanent ill effects."

    What like bleeding ears?! ... plus I can't wait for this to be used in town (*shakes head*), where the buildings could create reflections of the sound, creating constructive as well as destructive interference patterns, leading to some areas experiencing greater air pressures outside of the "safe" range of 30m which non-technical police and other "menial labourers" have estimated to be safe to blast people with it.

    Plus how long before riot-control device is reinterpreted into protest-control device.

    1. Jaques Croissant
      Unhappy

      also..

      The fun thing is that "less than lethal" weapons can be deliberately misued- like the baton rounds that are supposed to be bounced off the ground. The Israeli (and the British, in NI) have been known to fire them directly at the face or groin, where they are somewhat more dangerous.

      You can see the potential for misuse on a grand scale, for chasing down, penning up and then torturing protesters en masse.

  4. John 62
    Alert

    bird scarers

    there used to be a few in the fields near where I live. Took me a while to realise it wasn't just farmers out with shotguns at all hours.

  5. Michael Habel Silver badge
    Boffin

    So...

    Does this mean, that with the future micronizations made to this Technology we could have some Sonic Screwdrivers??

    Will they work with the Imperial System though?

  6. The elephant in the room
    FAIL

    So its a bird scarer

    Like the ones that have been deployed by farmers for many years.

  7. Inachu
    Flame

    The germans were compensated for this yes?

    Oh wait.

    The military of any country has the right to violate Intellectual Property.

  8. Mike 140
    Pirate

    But, ....

    ... can it be fitted to a shark?

  9. lukewarmdog
    Badgers

    Dammit

    Now I need to dig a bigger hole for my secret bunker.

    /grumble

    1. Sir Runcible Spoon Silver badge
      Pirate

      Sir

      not so secret now is it har har

      you're days of attaching frickin lasers to dolphins is over, lukewarmdog.

      Anyway, you need a scarier handle, that just didn't sound right :P

  10. Justin 17

    A pulse jet is a not a pulse detonation engine

    A pulse jet as used in the V-1 is not a pulse detonation engine. The fuel/air mixture in the pulse-jet deflagrates ie the combustion is controlled by a flame front, as opposed to the PDE where the mixture detonates due to the passage of a shock wave.

    Pedantry?

    Deflagration is sitting in front of a warm toasty fire in your front room, detonation brings the house down around your ears.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Re:

    "Fuel-air explosions can also be generated without a confining container, as in the various kinds of "bunker buster" munitions employed by the world's militaries"

    As in Buncefield.

    That woke us up at 6am 20 miles away.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Flame

      Woke me up...

      ... 1 mile away, thought it was a weird thunder and went back to sleep almost immediately to the sound of rain on the roof (which actually turned out to be ash).

      Phone didn't stop ringing for the rest of the day.

  12. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "instantly deadly to anyone hearing them"

    I think "instantly deadly to anyone feeling them" would make more sense. "Hearing" implies that the deaf would be invulnerable...

  13. Stoneshop Silver badge
    Boffin

    Proven tech

    "to deliver sound rays so powerful as to be instantly deadly to anyone hearing them."

    Those sound waves are obviously modulated with The Deadliest Joke In The World.

    1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
      Coat

      Hah!

      Must be a Jewish joke then

  14. ITDirector
    Megaphone

    Pardon?

    So the user makes a 'king loud noise, attracts a lot of attention from the rioters, who put on their ear defenders and eliminate the threat at source...

    Sounds (sorry) like the only people hurt will be the innocent bystanders and the disposable idiot holding the device!

  15. Pete 2 Silver badge

    broken windows, much?

    Where exactly could this kind of anti-citizen device be used? Deploy it in an open field and all you'll do is liquify a few unsuspecting hikers (or maybe the odd fox hunt). Use it in a built-up area against, say some demonstrators and what will happen then?

    Now, it's been awhile since I did any microwave physics, but I do seem to recall that if an aperture is small compared to the wavelength of the radiation, then it effectively acts as a point-source and the microwaves (or in this case, sound waves) are propagated in all directions. If you want to direct your "non leathal" sound waves, you'll need a aperture comparable to the soundwave's wavelength. If this turns out to be a "whooompf" (technical term) then you'd get a low frequency sound and a correspondingly long wavelength. if this device is supposed to be prtable the aperture couldn't be more than a couple of metres, compared with (say) a 30m wavelength for a sub-sonic "ray". That's far too small to direct, so the radiated energy would be sprayed everywhere - including possibly back at the machines operatives.

    We've seen the results of urban explosions on TV - courtesy of the IRA. Lots of broken windows and flying glass. I can imagine a similar situation arising from the use of this puppy, too. It won't be so much the sonic effects that injure or kill (in a non-lethal way) the victims of this device, as the shards of flying glass it causes from blowing out the windows of all the nearby offices and houses.

  16. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Coat

    Also described in an old book

    "German Secret Weapons of WWII" as the "Sound" or "Vortex" cannon I think, As seen on recent BB1 science programme Bang goes the theory.

    Note the beeb thingy was pretty sturdily built in welded steel. Not exactly a hand held personal defense weapon.

    The safety range limits sound remarkably like those for "rubber" bullets, that favorite of the RUC in the 70's and 80's. They definitely killed a few people but I'm not sure about this. High *continous* amplitude sound can be *very* destructive but this is more of a single pulse.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Unhappy

    What goes around...

    So the Fourth Reich is re-developing Third Reich weapons. No surprises there then. Other than until - as is usually inevitable - the weapons find their way to the other side.

  18. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Rodenator

    The Rodenator actually uses Propane and bottled oxygen...

    Oh, and we've got them in the UK too, damn effective against rat burrows, oh and yes, they are f****** loud!

  19. Austin Tayshus

    Does it

    work on rioting birds?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Joke

      You mean ...

      ... in Newcastle City Centre on a Friday night ?

      Will get my sound proofed coat with anonymous mask.

  20. Andus McCoatover
    Headmaster

    Vulcan bomber, anyone?

    All they've gotta do is resurrect these, and fly the mothers over a crowd, on full chat. Practically knocked me off my feet at at least 100 metres distance at an airshow years ago, exhaust pointed directly at me*.

    "to deliver sound rays so powerful as to be instantly deadly to anyone hearing them"

    Is that a reference to Vogon poetry?

    * Cor! What a lot of "at's" in one sentence! I can do a sentence with 5 consecutive "and's", but that's deliberate.

    Pedant alert, 'cos I must be losing my English grammar. Someone will correct, natch.

  21. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Thumb Up

    Saw the Rodenator video

    Why does the phrase "Flash fried mole" come to mind?

    @ Justin 17.

    Certainly is not. The more I have been reading round PDE's the more I wonder if (like the scram jet) *anyone* has got them to work. it all seems to hinge around the deflagration (2-4 ms) to detonation (2500ms+) transition. but the details seem elusive.

    1. Justin 17

      PDE

      In answer to the questions, just like Scramjets, no one has demonstrated a working PDE, they remain theoretical.

  22. mafoo
    Flame

    Balloons

    Filling a party balloon with a 2:1 mixture of Hydrogen and Oxygen has much the same result. the Shockwave is enough to smash windows and eardrums if done in a closed room.

    1. Pigeon

      What did your Mum say?

      I hope you hid behind the sofa.

      1. Allan George Dyer Silver badge
        Coat

        Of course he doesn't know what his Mum said...

        his eardrums were shattered!

        Pass my coat, I'm going to play next door.

  23. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    What we need is

    Ninjas with ear plugs.

    problem solved.

  24. Steve X

    Just visit a ski station

    They've been using these things for years to trigger avalanches after fresh snowfalls. Cheaper and safer than dropping sticks of dynamite out of helicopters, and yes they are fscking loud, even after echoing around a few alpine valleys.

  25. ian 22
    Megaphone

    A bit much?

    Too much of anything can be deadly. I'm awaiting a weapon that plays Mozart at 3000dB.

    Just turn the volume up to 1100.

  26. Martin 47

    speaking as a scarecrow

    they are no bloody use for scaring birds, so I suppose an alternative use needed to be found.

  27. gollux
    Coat

    And can be powered by cow farts...

    just give me my Acetylene Balloon, I can do it cheaper!

  28. Anonymous Coward
    Grenade

    Ouch.

    So anyone in 10 meters might get killed, that 314 square metres of death, and anyone within 30 metres, a further 2800 or so square meters could end up with undefined permanent injuries.

    It's not just the ears that don't like over pressure and shock waves, lungs are particularly vulnerable, then there are fetuses, intestines, eyes, brain.

    But hey, it's not as if this reusable, low cost weapon, running on easy to come by LPG rather than rationed bullets, is in the hands of a bunch of fuckers who'd... say... drive a bulldozer over a protestor to demolish a hospital, or lob a flechette shell into a playground, or shoot an aid worker through the head, so it's nothing to worry about.

  29. This post has been deleted by a moderator

  30. Joe User

    I see a new marketing opportunity

    Selling hearing aids to Somali pirates.

  31. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Thumb Up

    AC@17:05

    You forgot the "creative" use of White phospherous on hte West Bank.

  32. Alan J. Wylie

    Bang Goes the Theory

    But can it blow a house of straw/sticks/bricks down?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyAyd4WnvhU

  33. Sly
    Coat

    all your base are belong to us

    mines the one with the internet meme in the pocket

  34. JaitcH
    Black Helicopters

    Israeli weapons seem to be modelled after ...

    so many of secret Nazi superweapons of the 1940s. It's as if they are tied at the hip.

    Similarly, many of the Israeli practices against the Palestinians are alike to those used during the Second World War and given their history you would have thought that mistreatment by Hitler would have tempered their anti-Palestine actions.

    Unfortunately it appears the lesson of seventy years ago have been forgotten.

  35. undrgrndgirl

    if it's potentially lethal in 10 metres...

    doesn't that mean it will kill its operators???

    1. David Sidebotham
      Jobs Halo

      if it's potentially lethal in 10 metres..

      I have been 100m away from the tailpipe of a Vulcan at take off. I have also been 5m off the runway edge with a Tornado flight in full reheat and they are both really loud.

      We used to have model aircraft with pulse jet engines fuelled with petrol or gas (gas engines are easier to start). However it does not matter where you stand because two things are quite clear when they are going, there is a lot of thrust and THEY ARE VERY LOUD. It does not matter where you stand if you are within 10m you want to move away quickly. In comparison to an aircraft, and for something which is the size of an RPG luncher, the thought of using one as a weapon scares the shit out of me.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Unhappy

        Loud planes

        I remember driving round the inner perimeter road at Heathrow years ago, to return a hire car. Just as I was passing the end of the runway the whole world started to shake. I looked up through the sunroof...straight into 4 cones of violet flame from the engines of the Concorde that had just taken off over me. That plane was loud enough when heard from the terminal, but from right under the engines.... wow!

        Sadly missed :(

    2. Count Ludwig
      Coat

      Mine's the one with the ellipsis in the title...

      I expect they're wearing ear-defenders, just like any sensible rioters, who should already be wearing motorcycle crash helmets and body armour (rolled up newspapers work pretty well).

  36. John Smith 19 Gold badge
    Thumb Up

    @JaitcH

    "Similarly, many of the Israeli practices against the Palestinians are alike to those used during the Second World War and given their history you would have thought that mistreatment by Hitler would have tempered their anti-Palestine actions.

    Unfortunately it appears the lesson of seventy years ago have been forgotten"

    Not at all. The points of view which allow such behaviour are *highly* insideous. As the generation that witnessed its effects dies off I predict a further dropping in what is considered "Acceptable treatment." Look up the Stanford Prison Experiment for what "normal" people do given a uniform and a bit of power.

    Years ago I saw a video diary of a kibbutnik who'd been drafted to patrol the West bank (prior to the establishment of the Palestian state). His description of the settlers stuck in my mind as I had never heard the expression a "Jewish Fascist" before. I doubt this mindset has improved.

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