Lily Allen to judge Orange women's fiction award

Brit songstress Lily Allen has been selected a judge for next year's Orange Broadband Prize for Fiction, joining chair Kirsty Lang, Guardian Review editor Lisa Allardice, novelist Philippa Gregory and novelist, journalist and children’s author Bel Mooney on the panel for the women-only £30k award. Lang, described as a " …

[Anonymous Coward]

Satire is dead

First Henry Kissinger getting the Nobel Peace Prize, now this.

[Mike Crawshaw]

I call Sexism!!!

When's the competition for men-only authors????

[Anonymous Coward]

Unfair to think Lily Allen is not up to the job..

..when she has so much first-hand of experience of creative fiction; having created her own totally fictitious media persona in the manner of some of reverse Eliza Doolittle.

[Anonymous Coward]

Orange BB and Fiction

Rather apt...bit like "Unlimited" and "8 meg"

[cor]

Can she read?

The esteemed Lily is not exactly a star in the articulation dept., so I am curious to know if she can actually read literature. Or is she there for the benefit of publicity such as bestowed by El Reg i this article? No, that's far too cynical.

[Anonymous Coward]

Sexist

How is it these women only things are possible, if there was mens only literature award there would probably be uproar. And before someone says something like there is too many men dominating things its bull its the womans choice to get involved or not and if they feel they can't because there is too many men thats their problem. The pendulum always swings both ways.

[Rob]

the women-only £30k award

I thought we were meant to be big on sexual equality these days? :(

yes, i am not a woman, I feel discriminated against, & how do you know i have not written a book.

[Phantom Wibbler]

Maggie Gee...

...has nicely demonstrated how many authors are so far up their own backsides that they think regular people cannot possibly pass judgement on their written works. A panel full of 'serious authors' is surely a bit like pigs wallowing in their own filth?

PS: Where's the Paris angle?

[Matt Eagles]

@ Sexist

Perhaps the Man Booker Prize is the men only version?

The dust jacket please....

[Hollerith]

ambivalent

For those not familiar with Feminism 101, oppression does not go upward. If you are not treated as equal by the group that holds power, excluding them does not oppress them. In South Africa, Black-only organisations did not oppress whites. Whites were outraged that they couldn't go anywhere and be allowed in, but their outrage did not arise from oppression, but from a limit to their (immoral) power.

Clearly, women are not oppressed in the same way. But when so many prizes, top-level jobs, (heck, even middle-manager jobs) go to 'chaps like us' or the 'face that fits', it is not suprised that women see themselves as being treated unequally.

I believe that the Orange Prize was set up because the organisers felt that the major literature awards were disproportionately being given to men, and that they could level the playing field a bit by setting up this prize.

However much I am in sympathy with them, I am also torn, because being the top in a smaller, exclusionary field is surely never as satisfying. For instance, do you want to win 'woman web designer of the year' or 'web designer of the year'? Or 'Asian manager of the year' or 'Manager of the year'?

[triky]

when women get paid as much as men...

... we will allow you to enter our 30k award ;)

*ducks and runs*

[John]

Consider the lillies

I am so out of touch - I had to stop and wonder who Lily Allen is. I thought it was the glitzy Liverpudlian who presents Blankety Blank, but that's Lily Savage isn't it? Now I could understand that being a controversial choice.

[Anonymous Coward]

@Phantom Wibbler

Like all forms of art, you need to have studied a little to be able to criticise effectively. It's a pretty crap award if a random group of readers all vote for their favourite book.

[Anonymous Coward]

re: when women get paid as much as men...

Its not only women that get paid less than men other men also get paid less that some other men, imagine that. It all depends if u have got the balls/ego/ability to dare/warrant asking for more money. I for one do alot more innovation than some of my esteem colleagues but the height of my rewards was a £15 book token, a slap in the face really, but i just don't have the balls to ask for more money so I'm stuck with what i have, probably wouldn't give it to me anyway. Oh and believe it or not there is women getting paid more than me, must be sexist.

@Hollerith

Maybe in the 1800's early 1900's that was true and possibly in the city, but those guys are detached from reality, too much money :). But in general i think its just not true, out of the 3 teams i have been on 2 had female leaders so frankly i think this so called inequality is balls there is not some great conspiracy to put women down no matter how much feminist wish for it.

I'm getting my coat 'cause things could get nasty :)

[Anonymous Coward]

Straight from the horse's mouth, no less

This is a posting on Ms Allen's MySpace blog: "leona lewis is well nang . nuff said . i have just watched all her x factor performances , i love her, no one can touch that girl . big up leona ."

If that's not literature...

[chris]

It's a luffely book, ain't it?

I can't wait

The Viz annual is going to win it; you know its just and true.

[Tawakalna]

Why oh why oh why...

..wasn't the lovely Paris chosen instead?

[Anonymous Coward]

@Hollerith

It's not all one-way traffic on the inequality front though. For example, compare the salaries for female pr0n stars compared to their male counterparts and you'll see that the ladies are considerably better off. Also, how many men do you see working at the best lapdancing clubs? You can't have it both ways.

Don't bother with the taxi, I've got my running shoes on.

[Anonymous Coward]

Orange prize

Does anyone, apart from a few luvvies pay attention to the Orange Prize. I never read novels so I don't think I have ever looked at any of the winners.

Give me a proper non-fiction book any time, where someone has had to do some research and proper work in writing the book.

[Hollerith]

@anon coward

We can all point to women who earn plenty more than men, and have more power, too. I can do so in my own company. But the stats come out with depressing sameness: women are *over all* paid less than men, and women *over all* are less frequently seen in the higher echelons of management. Replace 'woman' with 'non-white male' and I suspect it would remain true.

I look at the middle and upper management of my own (very big) company and see one woman and one non-white man, out of a good round dozen. They are there, but what does that say about society as a whole? They are the exceptions.

Does that mean the woman manager here would like to win 'woman manager of the year', or the Black make manager 'Black manager of the year'? Hmmm. Don't know. Yet what are the chances of them winning 'manager of the year'?

As I said, I am not sure what to think about women-only areas of competition. I can see the place for them, and I don't think they are sexist, but I would much rather win the Man Booker Prize than the Orange Prize. Because then I would know I had been up against the toughest opposition.

Of course, to win ANY prize with money would be great. My personal competition of choice is the Lottery. Totally gender and race neutral!

[Anonymous Coward]

Bah!

All this fuss for some broad trouble?

[Chris]

@Anonymous Coward: in re porno

Men in gay porn make way more then female porn stars.

And they make so much more than the average straight male porn star that my lifelong dream has gone from being a porn star to being a gay porn star.

[Matt]

They earn more because

They work more......

ON average Men work more hours, and see their families less than women do.

Work the same fucking hours and you'll get the same money.

Equality is a 1 way street and there is no chance of them turning it into a 2 way street with the attitude of some people.

I won't be needing my coat I think they called an ambulance

[Anonymous Coward]

@hollerith

I remember in careers day in high school.

Me to cop "I would like to join the police like my grandfather did."

Cop to me "Good luck. There not hiring white males because they have to even out the ranks."

Its not so much he told me that. Its more that if I ever dare to complain to a woman about it I get told about centuries of oppression.

This anonymous because 1) I want to get laid at some point in my life. 2) I don't want anyone here know I wanted to be a cop.

[Michael Reed]

and another thing...

It's particularly maddening in the case of a field in which women are so well represented as book authorship.

[triky]

have to agree hollerith

i've worked in places ranging from your local shop to big multi-nationals.

on all my lowly paid jobs, men and women were relatively equal. but when you get to the big company/organisation, well there were much fewer women than men. Sure there are women managers, but organisations prefer to move them around vertically than up the ladder...

and that's beside the fact that women are often the target of seedy jokes and unfair judgment. if she makes a bad decision 'well what do you expect from a woman' and if she makes a good one 'well at least she's got some brains as well as an ass/titties/pretty face' (select appropriate).

i'm not all that bothered but i wanted to back hollerith on this point. there is certainly a wiff of inequality in the air that makes it necessary for women to fight harder... i personally think that's part of life and i deal with it, but it isn't always as easy or as fair as men think.

[Mark]

Lily Allen, a truly modern entertainer and social warrior - don't need talent, she's got cash.

So far as I can see, Lily is as vacuous, sarcastic and spoilt as her father is arsey and unpleasant. Lets see, dad Keith employs a whole bands worth of very expensive session musicians for her online musical debut, ensuring that her rise to fame is as undeserved as his own. So relying on dad's large pot of cash to buy celebrity is a shining example to all feminists is it? Frankly, here in Brighton you can go to any open mike night and see girls that are exponentially more talented than Lily, who also almost certainly know exponentially more about social politics.

[Anonymous Coward]

Minority Group

You want a group that is always being picked on and no-one ever stands up for, you want a group that is constantly harassed and has no protection from society..... you want the middle-class white male, we got fek all rights and no special award ceremonies.

(Posted from a distance as already had coat on and was just warming up for the run)

Disclaimer: This post was written entirely in "jest" and represents what is by today's standards called a wind-up. In no way does it, or can it be implied that the writer has any purely sexist or racist views that would be detrimental to any minority groups. Without Prejudice (I don't think I can cover my arse any more than that).

[Colin Jackson]

Ah yeah but...

"I look at the middle and upper management of my own (very big) company and see one woman and one non-white man, out of a good round dozen."

Then women are grossly underrepresented in your organization, but non-white men are about proportionally represented.

All the points about women's inequality are correct but miss the point. Women are NOT under-represented in the literature department and have not been for a long time. There is no inequality for women writers that I can see, or if there is it's a simple matter of markets forces. And if IIRC, there are more women readers than male readers, so they can only have themselves to blame. So it's a bit of a shame to make an issue out of it where there is non, when there are so many areas of life where there is a very big issue indeed.

/me waits with baited breath for "My Booky Wook" to win.

Mine's the one with the padded elbows...

[triky]

@ colin

fair enough. i was mostly responding to the comment

"ON average Men work more hours, and see their families less than women do.Work the same fucking hours and you'll get the same money."

although if that was a joke, well then slap me silly and call me paris hilton..

[Charlie]

Re: Consider the lillies

Are you having a go at the flowers now???

"If Lily reads a lot, whole books and serious books, then she is a fair choice"

I love the way that sentence was extensively qualified. Guess 'Hello' is out then?

Re. Minority Group

I'm a white male, age 18 to 49. Everyone listens to me -- no matter how dumb my suggestions are! Mmmm, nuts and gum.

[Rob]

@Charlie

"I'm a white male, age 18 to 49. Everyone listens to me -- no matter how dumb my suggestions are! Mmmm, nuts and gum."

lol your not a politician then, as soon as they do stop listening though, get yer butt down Parliment with CV in hand.

[Matt]

@triky and @minority Groups AC

Have you ever actually moved up the ladder or just viewed it from the bottom?

If so you'll see that the bottom rung has LOTS of jokes directed at EVERYONE. But no just shut your eyes to that.

I have never heard the excuses for women making bad decisions in a managment position that you have written (or for anyone).... If you screw up, doesn't matter what gender/race/orientation you are, your still out on your arse.

Seriously, stop making excuses and make a decision..... Equality means that you have to pick one OR the other. Work or family, you can't earn the most money AND spend all your time with your family.

And as AC further up said, the most unprotected shit upon class IS the white male.

[triky]

@ Matt

well, i am not old enough to start a family and anyway, i don't see how having children is related to the argument i was making earlier. So your comment on 'stop making excuses and make a decision' is beyond the point. I was not arguing about choosing between career and children, i am talking about equality in salaries.

And i admit that i have only been working in 'white collar' jobs for 3 years. Even if my experience is limited, i can still read an organisational chart. When out of 30 odd people at the top of the pyramid, only one is a woman, well this makes me wonder how hard the competition will be to get up there.

Finally, i just want to say that i do deal with it. i was stating a simple fact that i have observed and my life goes on regardless of whether people choose to pretend that some discrimination is inexistent because they have never seen/heard it. Sure there is unequality in all classes/race/sex by all kinds of people. It's not because it exists in many cases, that it is excusable in any of them.

[Chris Hunt]

Ahem

"Orange women's fiction award"? Surely Judith Chalmers would be the obvious choice?