Prominent Brit law firm instructed to block Brexit Article 50 trigger Law firm Mishcon de Reya has been instructed to launch a legal challenge to block Britain from leaving the European Union, in spite of the popular vote to leave the bloc. Solicitors and barristers from Mishcon de Reya are working with Blackstone, Matrix and Monckton Chambers to argue Article 50 of the European Union – the …
Well Labour is another kettle of fish.
A leader supported by the "members"; a useful number of whom joined so that they could support Corbyn, rather than having any affinity with the Labour party as such.
It is not the first time that "entryists" have taken the reins of the Labour Party and made it unelectable. But these people don't care about being elected into power. They are waiting for the masses to rise up and take control of the means of production. They want to "raise class conciousness". And anything that gets the workers stirred up is grist to their mill. Come the revolution they expect to be marching at the front carrying the banners. It's the Marxist view of History.
Unfortunately the normal view of history tells us that if the moment did come they are more likely to be among the first hanging from the lampposts.
Cameron's true plan was rather last-minute and he forgot to infom the electorate about it. Before the referendum date he was saying that he was best placed to negotiate the exit with the EU, indicating he had some and of contingency plan when he hadn't. Not the best way to keep the protest vote down (not that there is such a thing as a protest vote with a referendum}.
@codejunky - what he has done is lie his way into a leave vote using fear, hate and a complete lack of anything other than contempt for truth. We're now facing leaving the EU, with the leavers pulling back on every promise with a "well, it wasn't really a promise, more a something that might maybe happen if maybe we voted to leave, also it wasn't me that said it".
No party had an exit plan, no party expected us to leave, the entire thing was a "lets put it to the vote to try and get a few more concessions out of the EU", I'm sure the look on Boris' face when he found out he won was "oh fuck".
@ David Webb
"what he has done is lie his way into a leave vote using fear, hate and a complete lack of anything other than contempt for truth"
That might be your interpretation but his honesty over the EU got us the referendum and for those interested in facts instead of the official campaign FUD (of both sides) he was about it. The remain campaign existed entirely of fear, hate and complete lack of truth so thats not really much of an argument beyond how embarrassing this referendum was.
"with the leavers pulling back on every promise with a "well, it wasn't really a promise"
The official camp did yeah. UKIP aint in charge. They cant make promises unless they are voted in. UKIP and Nigel were excluded from the official campaign. Didnt Cameron promise to execute the will of the people once the vote was made? Didnt he promise us WW3? What time does that start? Or maybe we should trust the EU president who claimed its the end of western civilisation? Didnt Osborne promise to punish the wrong answer with an emergency budget he absolutely needed to do?
"the entire thing was a "lets put it to the vote to try and get a few more concessions out of the EU""
I am not convinced since Cameron tried that and throughout has been told- No. The EU didnt want to budge nor fix their crisis and we voted out. Now they are hoping to hold things together.
You can be bitter about the result of the vote, plenty of us are irritated at the lack of political spine to do as was promised and brexit. Nigel did as he set out to do and got us a referendum.
On the topic of hate, I think hate crime against ethnic minorities and foreigners is on the rise.
http://bfy.tw/6aFF
So much about Remain campaign being based on hate and Leave campaign being based on kisses and cuddles.
Or is this another media campaign by the Remain?
"That might be your interpretation but his honesty"
Oh, DO fuck off - you clearly don't know what the word "honesty" means if you think Farage has EVER got within a country mile of it.
Seriously? Are you THAT gullible? Or did you just like his brand of "civilised" bigotry?
He certainly did what he set out to do, which was to get the UK out of the EU, despite not having a majority. He frightened Cameron into a referendum, so on sheer power politicking, he won. But that he stood as an MEP and took money for somethign he professes to despise makes him look less than honourable. He also slandered his fellow MPs, which the Guardian neatly demonstrated. Being 'effective' in getting your way does not mean admirable. You can be effective as a a liar and a bully.
He certainly did what he set out to do, which was to get the UK out of the EU,
Nope. Not even close. The UK need to activate "Clause 50" for the "get out of the EU"-part, but, it seems increasingly clear that not a single one of the buffoons, who presumably wanted Brexit, are actually up for delivering it.
Come September, all of that heady posturing will have been walked back. Just wait and see.
You're joking right?
Regardless on your position on the referendum he went before a whole bunch of MEPs right before we are going to start negotiating with them on terms for us leaving the EU and insulted each and every one of them.
Basically :
Farrage : "Right, Your all a bunch of scrounging twats, Britain hates you and you can all fuck off"
MEPs : Face palm (Literally - watch the video)
Farrage : *Claps hands* "Lets get down to negotiating trade agreements".
Im paraphrasing but not by much. The man is a cockwomble of considerable magnitude.
I only hope that his leaving UKIP doesnt mean that he is defecting to the conservatives where he might end up in a position with some influence.
Essentially then, the referendum achieved its primary, and only achievement. Farage stepped down/UKIP imploding. Pretty sure the Tories are grateful for that. After all they have been hanging on as a pseudo-party with hordes of potential Euro-sceptic mutineers for years. Pity they had to f**k Blighty over to get to that goal.
"bunch of MEPs right before we are going to start negotiating with them on terms for us leaving the EU and insulted each and every one of them."
Who cares MEPs have no real power they are a waste of space and money. Farage knows that he has been one for years.
"Who cares MEPs have no real power they are a waste of space and money."
Dear Inmypjs, where are you based? Presumably not in the UK as earlier you assumed that Westminster MPs can propose bills (which they can do in theory, but not effectively in practice). Now I get the impression that you're not based in the EU either as you seem to be unaware of the fact that the MEPs will (as I understand it, but I'm no expert) have to vote on any post-Brexit deal.
"Farage knows that he has been one for years."
Incidentally, has he resigned from the EU parliament? Is he still collecting his EUR 8,200/month salary?
@ H in The Hague
"Incidentally, has he resigned from the EU parliament? Is he still collecting his EUR 8,200/month salary?"
Out of interest what is the complaint against this? Right now we are still in the EU and the anti-democratic are looking to override the result of the democratic 1 man 1 vote. If we actually leave as was the point of the vote and the expressed wish then he is out of a job. If we are to remain then he is the elected representative for a lot of people all over the UK in the EU.
I laughed when Junker asked him why he is still there. He is still there because we are yet to leave.
@ Stoneshop
"Do look up the words "opportunist" and "hypocrite"."
But it is our remaining in the EU which keeps him employed in the EU. The vote was cast, the result in. So if we remain in the EU then the remain crowd want him (as well as all MEP's) to be employed there. And if we leave then he will be out of a job when we actually do what we said we would. He is not opportunist or hypocrite, he is holding the UK gov to account over its promises.
You want him out then tell your MP to kick the gov to get us out. He shouldnt need to quit unless the democratic vote is being ignored. Should he?
So if we remain in the EU then the remain crowd want him (as well as all MEP's) to be employed there
Given his recent speech, do you really think his fellow UKMEPs still want him there? And I doubt that any BRemainer has had positive feelings about him anyway.
You want him out then tell your MP
Who would that be?
He shouldnt need to quit unless the democratic vote is being ignored.
Out of principle would be another reason. But that's a word that's apparently not in Ravage Farage's vocabulary.
@ Stoneshop
"Given his recent speech, do you really think his fellow UKMEPs still want him there? And I doubt that any BRemainer has had positive feelings about him anyway."
Is it up to them? I thought we voted for MEP's, it was one of those claims of democracy. And since he is employed to be there and is so until we leave the solution is simple. The promised referendum which will be carried out once the result is in should be carried out. Then he is out of a job. Or if we remain then so does he, representing 52% of the population.
"Who would that be?"
I dont know who your MP is.
"Out of principle would be another reason. But that's a word that's apparently not in Ravage Farage's vocabulary."
You dont seem to understand principle. If he is a man of principle then he is right to wait there until we actually leave the EU as the vote is to leave the EU and apparently the result of the referendum would be followed. So he should not resign because his job should come to an end due to the referendum. As an elected representative with a majority backing for his position (52%) he would be wrong to leave the post.
Talking of principle that would be following the promises of the referendum. So the gov should get on with it.
Your reading comprehension is beyond abominable.
Is it up to them? I thought we voted for MEP's, it was one of those claims of democracy.
Regardless of whether one's elected democratically into a council or parliament (and through whatever method, FPTP, PR or Preference Voting) anyone in that assemblage can have their personal opinion on whether to like or dislike a particular member, considering him or her worthy of a seat or not, and wanting that member to stay or leave. And I doubt there's much love lost between MEPs with BRemain leanings and Nigel Ravage. I do doubt that quite strongly.
The promised referendum which will be carried out once the result is in should be carried out.
You had your referendum already, and I gathered the BRexiters didn't want another one.
I dont know who your MP is.
I already mentioned that I am not directly affected by BRexit, but to help you grasp what I mean by that: I am neither an UK resident nor an UK citizen, and ergo I do not have a "my MP".
If he is a man of principle then he is right to wait there until we actually leave the EU
One may take that view, yes. Another is that he's involved in, and paid by, an organisation he despises, an attitude one may well call hypocritical and dishonest.
I read your post. Nobody is laughing.
A maniac with a fixed idea. Complaining how the EU is run by unelected bureaucrats, when UKIP's fearless leader has been elected for 17 years, but instead of doing his job he has been working hard to destroy everything.
And then he showed them in the EU parliament. Well, nobody was laughing. And what he said will be remembered. That little speech will cost the UK billions in lost goodwill and lost negotiations.
Even after a vote, would the house of lords have to review it, and send it back to paliament if they didn't like the outcome? (And the brexit people complain about the EU being full of unelected law makers. The EU is far more democratic than Her Maj's government).
"The EU is far more democratic than Her Maj's government" -
You cannot be serious.
The EU laws are decided upon and drawn up by an unelected council. The elected members only get to vote on whether it passes or fails (they might have a right to amend, I'm not sure).
But given that they are all career politicians (at best), looking for a notch up the ladder of the bourgeoisie, nothing ever gets rejected.
So no, it's the opposite of democratic in practice when it comes to legislation.
Neither was it democratic for the EU council to insist on the removal of the greek prime minister during the financial issues, and instead replaced him with one of their own people without a democratic election.
It also wasn't particularly democratic to ignore several countries "NO" to the very first nation state referendums on the Lisbon Treaty, and bring it in via the back door anyway. Not to mention that all of the UK ever voted for was a single market. And on the back of that 'vote', we've been signed up to the European Court of Human Rights with no control over the majority of the laws imposed upon us, and are (were?) on a course for 'ever increasing political and fiscal union', with Germany apparently in control of pretty much everything.
This is not democracy.
The EU laws are decided upon and drawn up by an unelected council. The elected members only get to vote on whether it passes or fails (they might have a right to amend, I'm not sure).
Bit like Westminster then. Or would be, if "EU laws" existed.
People have tried to improve democratic accountability within the EU, but UK governments (of both parties) have blocked such attempts. Perhaps the reason we can get out now is because eastward expansion has made it unlikely they'll get agreement on that kind of reform any more even without the UK to block it?
"The EU laws are decided upon and drawn up by an unelected council. "
Being "unelected" is not a synonym for "lacking democratic legitimacy".
The European commission is appointed by elected governments and approved by the European parliament. So you have two ways to influence it. And this has parallels in both the UK and the US. In the US, the whole "cabinet" is unelected - appointed by the elected head of state. And the British government can appoint ministers by making them members of the House of Lords.
And while, yes, only the Commission can initiate legislation, the European parliament can ask the Commission to draft legislation as, apparently, can we - if we can get a million signatures on a petition. This was decided upon to stop the kind of chaos you see in the US where both houses start bills and then fight over whose bill gets through.
But in both the UK, (MPs) and USA, (Congressmen and Senators), your elected representatives, can table bills to their parliaments. This is the basis of electing MPs in the first place to support/help/improve your/their constituencies.
MEPs CANNOT suggest legislation, but can only debate and reject it just like a member of the House of Lords. If you can't see the difference then shame on you.
"But in both the UK, (MPs) and USA, (Congressmen and Senators), your elected representatives, can table bills to their parliaments."
Yes, in theory. In practice private members' bills don't stand a chance of becoming law, unless they're supported by the government. You have to win a lottery to get a chance to present one, or use the ten-minute rule. Basically, that ain't going to work.
http://www.parliament.uk/about/how/laws/bills/private-members/
Hence in practice there's little difference in this respect between the EU and the Westminster parliaments.
This post has been deleted by its author
"The European commission is appointed by elected governments and approved by the European parliament."
In practical terms, is anyone ever going to be appointed by their elected government if they're not sufficiently communitaire? And even if they did what would their influence be?
"And on the back of that 'vote', we've been signed up to the European Court of Human Rights with no control over the majority of the laws imposed upon us, [...]"
The ECHR is not part of the EU. It was set up much earlier - just after the war - with the express support of Winston Churchill.
Are you perhaps thinking about the European Court of Justice (ECJ)? That is part of the EU.
>we've been signed up to the European Court of Human Rights with no control over the majority of the laws imposed upon us
Ahem - didn't we at least help shape it, if not provide the driving force behind the contents:
More eloquently put by Jean-Luc Picard in disguise
Democracy in the UK? Let me see now.
Like around 75% of the population I live in a safe seat so right from the off my vote is basically worthless. In fact right now my MP (by which I mean the MP that was foisted on me) is trying vainly to become Prime Minister(*). That's a process over which I (like probably 95% of the population) have absolutely no say in.
So it's possible that the most important decision to affect the UK in my lifetime is going to be taken not only by someone over whom I have no control whatsoever but someone who I didn't even know was going to be in the position to make that decision.
Meanwhile when it comes to the EU my vote counts as much as anyone else'. I ended up with a nice representation of two Conservative, two UKIP and one Labour MEP this time around.
(*)In the unlikely event that she succeeds I'm going to write to her and ask if she finally has enough power to give the go-ahead to the Farthinghoe bypass. Last time I enquired I was told she had no control over local transport policy :-/
Your vote is not worthless, it is instead worth the same as everyone else's
This isn't sour grapes talking. I'm not objecting to the result as such because I would normally rather help the Conservatives than any other party. In practical terms I get the MP I'd vote for anyway most of the time. However I don't see why I should ignore that fact that were I to change my mind it wouldn't make any difference. Whether I vote or not and who I vote for in a general election is irrelevant to the outcome.
Where is the democracy in that?
Quote: "Your vote is not worthless, it is instead worth the same as everyone else's. That you live in an area where the majority of people disagree with your point of view does not make your vote worth less."
Funny, I think exactly this can be said of the referendum.
"So it's possible that the most important decision to affect the UK in my lifetime is going to be taken not only by someone over whom I have no control whatsoever but someone who I didn't even know was going to be in the position to make that decision."
hmmm... I wonder if we can find any parallels in recent times.... like perhaps when Blair handed the reigns of government to Brown but I'm guessing you think thought that was ok.
hmmm... I wonder if we can find any parallels in recent times.... like perhaps when Blair handed the reigns of government to Brown but I'm guessing you think thought that was ok.
You'd be guessing bloody wrong then, probably because you have absolutely zero data to work with. I detest Gordon Brown with a passion and since that was a Labour government I didn't want any of them to be in a position of power in the first place.
My dislike has nothing to with political leanings. It's a complaint about political process. I have always disliked mid-term changes of PM going back to Thatcher->Major. Not because of the change (Maggie needed to go) but simply because whilst none of us elect the PM we do have a certain expectation when we vote and it feels wrong.
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