UK watchdogs ask how they can better regulate algorithms

UK watchdogs under the banner of the Digital Regulation Cooperation Forum (DRCF) have called for views on the benefits and risks of how sites and apps use algorithms. While "algorithm" can be defined as a strict set of rules to be followed by a computer in calculations, the term has become a boogeyman as lawmakers grapple with …

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a pity that some "algorithms" are designed to modify themselves!!

....notably in the area of neural networks (so called AI) where the network is designed to "learn".

So.....it is perfectly possible to test such an application (in some limited way) before it is deployed in production.....but once the "learning" starts, the application is modifying its own behaviour.

A further snag with neural network technology is that it happens to be very poor at REPORTING its own behaviour. So asking such an application "Please explain the reasoning behind your latest result" is a waste of time.

"I'm sorry Dave....I can't do that!"

P.S. Jonathon Green suggests that an application should be subject "to human review". In the case of neural networks, his suggestion would need to require a "human review" once every day....or even once every hour! Good luck with that!

[amanfromMars 1]

Re: It's a pity that some "algorithms" are designed to modify themselves!!

Yes, it is a bit of a swamp for skunkworks, AC, and in the acceptance of that realisation along with the ability to navigate it safely and securely above the fray, lie all of the opportunities that are rewarded with riches beyond measure and compare ....... and that is most probably why it is proving so popular and troublesome in fields which are considered by former traditionally established bodies, both vital and unavoidable for command and control, but innavigable by such former traditionally established bodies themselves.

[Jonathon Green]

Re: It's a pity that some "algorithms" are designed to modify themselves!!

“P.S. Jonathon Green suggests that an application should be subject "to human review". In the case of neural networks, his suggestion would need to require a "human review" once every day....or even once every hour! Good luck with that!”

Actually that’s not what I had in mind,

it’s the individual decisions (refusal of a loan application, having a job application turned down, having a comment or post removed from a forum, having the area you live in excluded from a government program, etc, etc, etc) I’d like to see a Right of Review for where an automated system has been involved in the decision. In a lot of cases that’ll mean reviews being requested a *lot* more than once an hour and would be very, very, very expensive, possibly prohibitively so. I’m seeing that as a feature rather than a bug…

[Phones Sheridan]

how they can better regulate algorithms

Easy, ban fraudulent ones. Take Google's search algorithm. Anyone with a website wholeheartedly believes that their SEO practices have got them onto the first page in Google. Only problem is, so do the other 1000000 owners of the other websites competing with them. There is only 5 slots available, yet 1000000 people think they have achieved to obtain one of them. The same goes for those people paying to appear in the search results. There is only a few slots available, yet thousands of people thinking they have managed to outbid their competitors. It's a con to anyone that can count.

[FlamingDeath]

Re: how they can better regulate algorithms

You’re conflating pay per click advertising with SEO

Two completely different things

[Phones Sheridan]

Re: how they can better regulate algorithms

No I'm not, I've listed both, because both are fraudulent.

[Ken Moorhouse]

They need to sort this problem quickly now...

They will no doubt use the bubble method.

[philstubbington]

Re: They need to sort this problem quickly now...

Well, that’s either true or false.

[YakkingUdon]

Watchdog seeks meta-algorithm which bites algorithm

To understand a disordered/chaotic world, it's encapsuled analytical methods all the way down.

[BlokeInTejas]

Algorithms aint nuttin new...

Algorithms....

Well, they've been in use.. forever.

Been employed? The employer had an algorithm to sort out the likely candidates from the less likely, and one to decide when to stop sorting.

Ever had a pay raise? Algorithm.

Ever got fired? Algorithm.

Ever got stopped for speeding? Algorithm.

Ever been convicted of a crime? Algorithm.

Ever paid tax? How much you were supposed to pay was set by an algorithm.

And all those and more were algorithms implemented by people. And apparently make society systematically racist. Or inegalitarian. Or rich. Or something that a whiner doesn't like.

I don't think the idiots muttering about algorithms have the vaguest idea of what an algorithm is.

But in the end, suppose that we have two companies (or equivalent large scale entities). One tunes its algorithms to find and hire mostly black candidates. The other tunes its algorithms to find and hire the best they can find, using the measures of competence and all the correlated data they've found.

Who likely gets the best additions to its workforce?

And if you don't like the wording 'to find and hire mostly black candidates', change 'black' for whatever. If you're not using the best search possible, you'll end up at a disadvantage.

So algorithms act in a competitive marketplace. So they'll get better.

Which leads to all sorts of issues, all of which are the same as if it the algorithms 'running' on humans instead of giant piles of silicon.

[Boris the Cockroach]

Just mention

algorithm is a islamic/muslim word

Should have the likes of dorris spitting out her tea and demanding its banned in case it tries to subvert web users into becoming terrorists

meanwhile

Quote

"a workplan for the coming year in which it aims to:

Better protect children online

Promote competition and privacy in online advertising

Support improvements in algorithmic transparency

Enable innovation in the industries they regulate"

Well there you go... think of the children..... that will get a tabloid or 2 on our side

The second point is a wtf are you on about.

The 3rd point is most people would'nt understand an algorithm if it was printed out in big letters and small words

And finally.. we're gonna regulate the internet advertisers... and fail just like every other attempt..

But hey.. it made so good headlines...

[ibmalone]

Herberts

Nice to see the Butlerian Jihad has arrived early

[Binraider]

Maybe someone was offended by the band of the same name?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zwG97ah0mEU