back to article Plans for UK rival to Silicon Valley ditched

UK efforts to create a high-tech research and development region designed to rival Silicon Valley seem dead in the water as government prioritises other initiatives. Oxford-Cambridge Arc had planned to create new road and rail links between the cities' universities and research centres in Milton Keynes, as well as housing and …

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  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

    So the Tories believe that putting in road links or building houses will magically create a competitor to silicon valley.

    Meanwhile, the EU have landed Intel investment for a fabrication plant in Germany, amongst other things.

    As per The Independent we have a trade deal with New Zealand which has a negative GDP effect. (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-trade-deal-new-zealand-uk-b2024793.html). Claims 0.02% extra GDP by 2035, yet other models show -0.01%. Farmers and food processors will lose out.

    Same for pig farming at the moment, where pigs are being culled rather than eaten.

    If the Tories cannot get farming right, then they have, probably, minus infinity chances of getting technology right.

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

      It's the kind of long-term strategic planning entirely expected from this bunch of journalists who do government by focus group.

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

        Waiting for Rees-Mogg's plan for one of these new canal links

        1. Neil Barnes Silver badge

          Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

          Slight delay envisaged while sufficient horses are produced to move the barges.

          1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

            Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

            >Slight delay envisaged while sufficient horses are produced to move the barges.

            We don't need horses, we just make the canal downhill - both ways

          2. jake Silver badge

            Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

            You don't want horses for that, you want mules. They are also happy working in teams of 20 or more, which would be quite handy when hauling the mountains of bullshit away from Westminster.

          3. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

            Horses? We can't be using valuable animals for such work! The barges will be haled by proles for their daily ration of gruel. The worst of it is I can hear his voice saying this...

        2. Licenced_Radio_Nerd

          Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

          You can travel up the river Great Ouse and back along the Cam, although that might take a few weeks!

          1. TRT

            Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

            I'm not entirely sure that such a venture would be a great idea - it would get referred to as Cam-Ousing Route. And you can't Google that! (At work anyway).

      2. Woodnag

        Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

        Silicon Valley is very cosmopolitan because of decades of influx of immigrant tech workers... Europe, Iran back in the day, more recently Taiwan, Korea, and of course India and China. Nowhere else in the US matches that with temperate weather. Seattle ain't bad, but "the skies... they be grey!".

        Glassdoor: "The average Google hourly pay ... $201 per hour for a Senior Software Engineer.".

        What's the UK going to offer to compete?

        1. jake Silver badge

          Re: Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

          It started long before the imigrant tech workers.

          Post WWII, people from all over the world attended Berkeley and Stanford. They discovered that what became Silly Con Valley was a very nice place to live, and upon graduation, stayed here.

          This lead to the plowing under of the orchards to create a new suburbia to house the large quantity of educated people. Many of these people had Engineering or Business degrees, some both.

          In essence, an educated melting-pot made this place what it is.

          Personally, I miss the cherries, plums, apricots, peaches, etc. ...

        2. Gene Cash Silver badge

          Re: Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

          Plus a big factor in California is the laws. There's no non-compete, so that let people leave Shockley Semiconductor to start Fairchild, then leave Fairchild to start Intel.

          So every engineer that thinks he can do it better, starts his own company to do so, and boom - you have Silicon Valley.

          1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

            Re: Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

            Massachusetts had/has notoriously strict non-compete enforcement that together with the highly secretive nature of the defence focused industry in Boston - compared to the (for some reason) much more open Californian attitude

            1. jake Silver badge

              Re: Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

              For some reason?

              Come visit California for a month. Then go visit New England for a month. All will be revealed.

              Nutshell: Here in California, we don't sweat the petty stuff. In New England (and most of the rest of the East Coast) it is canon to do so.

          2. LybsterRoy Silver badge

            Re: Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

            The bit you missed out about the laws is that you ignore those that don't suit so you can "disrupt"

            1. jake Silver badge

              Re: Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

              That "ignore the law" thing is actually fairly new, at least in the time scale of this conversation. Have no fear, there is a largish grass-roots effort to get this fixed. If we're lucky, they will get their comeuppance.

        3. LybsterRoy Silver badge

          Re: Silicon Valley is a destination for immigrant tech workers

          You need to read

          A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court

          to understand that the headline figure for salary is only part of the equation.

    2. DJO Silver badge

      Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

      I assume that is a rhetorical question.

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

        I left the UK for the West Coast 10 years ago.

        UK developer salaries aren't bad - as long as you are working in finance, in London.

        Outside that - forget it.

        I was chief dev / R&D / CTO for a company making high tech off-shore stuff. Not a bad salary for oop North, can buy a house etc (although to be fair you could buy a house on a credit card there)

        Our receptionist had a boyfriend, spotty 20 year old with no qualifications who worked in Software Sales to local government - he earned twice what I did.

        In the UK a techie is never going to get paid more than a saleman, who is never going to be paid more than a manager. If your only good jobs are worthless finance and government contracting you are not going to be creating silicon valley.

        1. LybsterRoy Silver badge

          Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

          --he earned twice what I did.--

          If he earned it great, if he just got paid it :(

          ps I think you'll find sales are generally better paid than the rest.

          1. This post has been deleted by its author

          2. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

            Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

            >ps I think you'll find sales are generally better paid than the rest.

            Yes have always believed that sales commission is the easiest cheque to write.

            Except if you are 'selling' software to local hospitals/GPs that some NHS digital program has decided everyone has to have. Its like getting a commission on selling F35s to each RAF unit

            The problem is when the most (only) profitable enterprise is getting on some government contract - you start to look like one of those 'less developed' countries.

            ps also realised 2006 was more than 15years ago. I can't be old - the 70s was only 25 years ago!

    3. Woodnag

      Intel investment for a fabrication plant in Germany

      Considering how strong the employee protections are in Germany compared with the UK, it shows how unattractive UK is despite Intel being able to hire/fire much easier in UK.

    4. LybsterRoy Silver badge

      Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

      Did we read different articles?

      --So the Tories believe that putting in road links or building houses will magically create a competitor to silicon valley.--

      Obviously, in fact they believe it so much they cancelled it!

    5. Arthur the cat Silver badge

      Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

      Same for pig farming at the moment, where pigs are being culled rather than eaten.

      I believe David Cameron had an idea about what to do with a pig.

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

        >Same for pig farming at the moment, where pigs are being culled rather than eaten.

        I generally prefer my pigs to be culled before being eaten.

        I like bacon as much as the next man but I think live pork sashimi is a bit much

        1. Tom 7

          Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

          Pigs that are culled are NOT eaten. You need them slaughtered for that - that requires a vet to check the meat is edible, The vets have gone back to the EU hence the need to cull animals - pigs especially as they cost as much as tory ministers to keep alive.

          1. jake Silver badge

            Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

            Pigs are actually cheap to raise. The only animals that I am aware of that make meat faster on less chow are rabbits. Turkeys are close.

            Regardless of what you call it (harvesting, culling, slaughtering, hit by car), if it's taken apart correctly and on time you can eat the end result ... assuming a lack of disease, of course.

            1. sabroni Silver badge

              Re: Regardless of what you call it (harvesting, culling, slaughtering....

              We're using culled to mean "killed for no reason" and slaughtered to mean "killed for food".

              The government in the UK likes to pretend they're both the same and that farmers shouldn't complain about culling pigs as waste because they also die when you slaughter them for food.

              1. Snapper

                Re: Regardless of what you call it (harvesting, culling, slaughtering....

                Fairly obvious this government doesn't realise/care that the Farmer loses money when pigs are culled, and gets paid when they are slaughtered.

      2. Allan George Dyer
        Paris Hilton

        Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

        @Arthur the cat - So that would be Eton, not eaten?

    6. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

      Building denser areas and improving transport will solve literally 90% of the problems in this fucking shithole of a country that is run by a bunch of arseholes who literally hate the people they are elected by and have contempt of the idea of government actually doing anything or investing for the long term.

      Solve housing costing 10x salary

      Solve everyone demanding a 4 bed with a large garden and build liveable flats or medium density

      Improve train, walking, cycling routes and get people interconnected and not spending 3 hours in a car to go 20 miles down the M25

      Stop treating WFH like a nasty disease.

      PAY PEOPLe

      Absolute joke of a country.

      1. keithpeter Silver badge
        Windows

        Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

        "Solve everyone demanding a 4 bed with a large garden and build liveable flats or medium density"

        @ac2022-03-01_16:42

        Come to Birmingham (within the Ring Road).

        Loadsa new low rise flats + medium density housing. Google Port Loop (Urban Splash development) Park Central (Crest Nick) and St Lukes Road (Barrat, not as bad as it sounds). Plus stuff happening out by the Commonwealth Games site (Perry Barr) and Hipsta Urban speculative build stuff in the actual centre of the city. If you have serious money there are a handful or several new terraced houses in the Jewellery Quarter, plus various smaller scale developments.

        What we actually need though is more council/housing association housing. Urgently.

        1. rg287 Silver badge

          Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

          Come to Birmingham (within the Ring Road).

          Well there’s the problem. Every German town over 250k people will have a robust urban rail/S-Bahn network. The only places in England making that happen are Birmingham and Manchester - big cities with over a million people who could easily justify their own metro/underground network - not just a glorified tram network (which does NOT constitute a “metro” regardless of how it’s branded).

          This leaves… everybody else (Leeds, Bradford, Derby, Stoke on Trent) struggling to convince Treasury that there’s any merit in public transport or that they need things like trams or walkable infrastructure.

          There’s an increasing case to be made that national government doesn’t really work. All the important issues are either inter-governmental (climate change, tax avoidance, trade treaties, etc) or local/regional (infrastructure, education, transport - guess why Germany has such good public transport - it’s managed at state/Lander level. Not reliant on begging Berlin for attention once every couple of decades. The decision-makers have skin in the game).

          The national government shouldn’t have responsibility for anything beyond defence and handling international treaties & relationships. Let the regions get on with sorting out infrastructure.

          Of course this government hates devolution - and not just in the regions. They’ve stripped TfN of their powers but also knee-capped TfL. Local authorities are on their knees after a decade of austerity. They’ve spent the last 5 years trying to centralise power back into Westminster and we’re all going to be poorer for it (unless you’re in a favoured “red wall” constituency, but even those brides will be transitory).

      2. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

        >bunch of arseholes who literally hate the people they are elected by

        No, they like the people they were elected by (subject to a certain latitude qualification)

        Those people own houses

        Those houses will go down in value if the government builds more/cheaper housing

        That will make those people poorer and sad

        They might not vote for you

        1. Evil Scot Bronze badge

          Re: Does the Tory Government Actually Know What It Is Doing ?

          They are quite happy to build when they are personally profiting on it. Looking at you former landlord.

          Well at least we wont have to pick up the rubbish in Cambridgeshire for a new town built in Bedfordshire.

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    has anyone told those that are building the line?

    "Although officially still on the table, there were doubts about whether the proposed Oxford-Cambridge railway link would go ahead. According to reports, the Treasury's spending review had failed to answer vital questions about funding for the project, which proposed reopening the old "Varsity line" closed since 1967."

    from where I am this East West line looks pretty far advanced to me.

    1. Paul Crawford Silver badge

      Re: has anyone told those that are building the line?

      Just looked it up: part of it done, part under construction, but seems about half is at "detailed design" stage.

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: has anyone told those that are building the line?

        Yes the only problems with it are at the ends where it goes into Oxford and Cambridge and starts going near "nice" houses.

        1. TRT

          Re: has anyone told those that are building the line?

          Pity it won't have a station interchange with HS2 at Calvert.

      2. Warm Braw

        Re: has anyone told those that are building the line?

        Oxford-Bedford will likely get built/upgraded. Beyond Bedford seems unlikely at present. Rail services in general are more likely to be cut. Welcome to Austerity++.

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Reports claim that Gove mimed sitting on a toilet and pulling the chain

    Pity he wasn't sitting in it. Has he ever got anything right?

    1. monty75

      Has he ever got anything right?

      His impression of children's TV character Pob is pretty bang on the money

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Throughout history, it's been seen time and time again that economic growth happens off the back of cheap energy resources. Because energy is the baseline cost of everything. Cheap energy makes projects economically viable that previously were not. Successive governments have repeatedly failed to invest in cheap energy and instead steered the country down the path of increasingly expensive energy. The plan to fix all this is to rely on somebody inventing a new and lucrative technology that will solve all of the our problems - which is a bit like relying on winning the lottery to pay your mortgage.

    1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      So ARM's low power design was all due to the 1984 miners strike ? Brilliant

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    3. This post has been deleted by its author

  5. theOtherJT Silver badge

    They've been talking about the varsity line since before I was born...

    ...and it never actually seems any closer to opening again.

    A quick google informs me that Oxford and Cambridge are more or less 65 miles apart as the crow flies, but the fastest actual route to get there involves driving 96 miles and includes going around part of the M25 which will take nearly 2 hours. If you want to take public transport it's even more dire taking 2 and a half hours and involving actually getting a train into London, getting the tube across the city, and then back out again from a different station.

    1. monty75

      Re: They've been talking about the varsity line since before I was born...

      Due to the free-for-all nature of 19th Century railway architecture it's almost impossible to make any East-West journey without having to go to London first

      1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

        Re: They've been talking about the varsity line since before I was born...

        Yes the network would have been much better if it had been planned by the central government in London for the convenience of MPs in the 1830s

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