SpaceX small print on Starlink insists no Earth government has authority or sovereignty over Martian activities SpaceX has ambitions for its Starlink constellation beyond annoying stargazers if the pre-order agreement for its satellite-based internet service is anything to go by. Spotted by Register reader Amarinder Brar during his UK application for the system, an intriguing section in the fine-print warns that disputes related to " …
Register Faction, sasa-ke ?
On the topic, while it's fun to poke fun, this is the right approach and completely consistent with Musk's stated goals. Get a topic into the public domain, get people talking about it, thrash something out ahead of time. No point rocking up on Mars and only then start dealing with the Popular People's Front grandstanding.
Of course, your average billionaire thinks laws, international or otherwise, are for little people and assume they can do what they like. They're generally right.
Except when it comes to the laws of physics, or economics. Then Musk is frequently wrong. But still a billionaire, so still doing something right I guess. But-
SpaceX boss Elon Musk is not messing about, and he'll have the keys to the airlock after all. Still, "disputes will be settled through self-governing principles, established in good faith, at the time of Martian settlement."
AFAIK, Musk isn't planning to be a space pioneer any time soon, so will be on firmer terror. Which leaves the keys to any airlocks in the hands of any Martian, or hacker. But I suspect that although there are treaties, they'll be quietly ignored as colonies are established and resource competition moves to the high frontier. The US already had plans to create a military base on the Moon, complete with modified claymores and Davy Crockett nuclear bazookas for defence.
Well.. It's declassified now, and strangely fascinating reading-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Horizon
Horizon was estimated to require 147 early Saturn A-1 rocket launches to loft spacecraft components for assembly in low Earth orbit at a spent-tank space station. A lunar landing-and-return vehicle launched on a Saturn A-2 would have shuttled up to 16 astronauts at a time to the base and back.
60 years later, guessing it'd probably still need that kind of number of launches given the logistics iinvolved in setting up and maintaining a fully operational battle station. And I guess for choice of location, how likely those choices would be complared to modern plans & ideally having local resources to cut down on the number.
Are the claymores anti-personnel mines, Scottish swords, or both? I'm imagining Highlander in Spaaace.
Hmm.. Best not go there. Highlander II did, sadly. Proof that an imagination can be a terrible thing. As could 2-h swords in space. On the plus side, Landsknechts in space may not fall foul of Game's Workshop lawyers, and carrying a zweihander might not be as tiring. But inertia would still be FUN, although firing off attitude thrusters & spinning in place(ish) with a large sword could be used for crowd control and attitude adjustment. I get the feeling alternatives may be more practical though, ie a stiletto for puncturing suits.
But the claymores were the good'ol anti-personnel mines. With some modifications to the fragments to apparently make them more effective. Can't remember if the declassified stuff went into details about how or why though.
OTOH, Davy Crockett's Nuclear Bazookas sound like a classic porn film title.
Product of a Cold War era and possibly lax budget controls. Perhaps a bit more useful on the Moon though as presumably it'd fly further and thus less risky for the folks firing it. But I'm now wondering if super-elevating it could result in the recoil/back-blast sending the firer sailing off in the general direction of the warhead..
>Well, it has been. In 1967, apparently.
>Of course, your average billionaire thinks laws, international or otherwise, are for little people and assume they can do what they like. They're generally right.
Elon Musk was born in 1971, this old Treaty apparently cannot apply to him, correctamundo? There is no way he could have even signed it! From a fan.
"Well, it has been. In 1967, apparently."
That treaty, although it talks about commercial use of space and stellar bodies, didn't really properly consider actual, independent commercial operations in space. I get the impression they were still thinking multi-billion dollar government based operations doing mining and stuff. While corporate space operations are tied to Earth, the treaty can be enforced. But what happens if or when there are self-sustaining operations out there?
The treaty makes signatory Earth governments responsible for the actions of their citizens. Someone born on Mars wouldn't necessarily be a citizen of any Earth government.
For sure, a birth on Mars is further in the future / less likely than a mission to Mars - but only by degrees.
On the topic, while it's fun to poke fun, this is the right approach and completely consistent with Musk's stated goals.
It raises a smiles, but on the flip side - SpaceX is a US Corporation which operates and launches from US soil, and when transmitting to UK users, they require spectrum licensed by Ofcom.
If Martian settlements choose to declare an independent Martian Congress then that's up to them and having a sample constitution isn't a bad idea.
But none of that has any bearing whatsoever on a constellation in Earth-LEO, operated by an Earth corporation.
SPOILER ALERT
In the continuation of the Rendezvous with Rama series, I recall that the Earthlings bound for a new colony on Mars were actually sent to an alien spaceship which took them on an interstellar trip, never to return to Earth. Does Elon know something we don't?
end SPOILER ALERT
"Does Elon know something we don't?"
Elon is obviously setting up his exit strategy. He has been amongst us long enough to study our weaknesses, and to formulate an invasion plan. He now just needs to set up a rendezvous with the mothership to make his way home. Why not Mars as the landing site?
What I forgot to say was that specifying the absence of Earthly law on Mars, or trips thereto, would mean that no one who was hijacked en route, or their relatives back home on Earth, could sue him or his company were anything or anyone to 'go astray' as it were. Although it will be interesting to see what laws the Earthly authorities consider apply.
As for immunity to anything, I have my Covid-19 Pfizer-BioNtech vaccination tomorrow afternoon :o)
He has a point.
After all a relatively small handful of frontiersmen (people for the PC) beat (or at least drew with) one of the foremost military powers.
Especially as the UN is irrelevant here on Earth so why should it have any effect on Mars?
Especially as Marsies will play up the 'God of War' aspect of their planet........
Hmm, if Mars does get settled I am sure it will eventually break free of the tyranny of Earthly domination - but.....for a few hundred years the power balance is going to be pretty easily with Earth.
Oh, you mean you forgot to pack a tin-opener? OK we could send you one.......
Always assuming that Perseverance doesn't round a corner and find itself served with a writ reminding us that "Yet across the gulf of space, minds that are to our minds as ours are to those of the beasts that perish, intellects vast and cool and unsympathetic, regarded this earth with envious eyes, and slowly and surely drew their plans against us. and being thoroughly up to date - you know it's going to involve lawyers....
Doesn't need to round a corner to get issued with a parking ticket.
You might joke about Martians, but looking at the photos, I see that Perseverance has what appear to be radiation warning signs in certain places. NASA must therefore believe that it will encounter someone who can recognise such a symbol.
"After all a relatively small handful of frontiersmen (people for the PC) beat (or at least drew with) one of the foremost military powers."
No, that's not what happened. For starters, it was more than a handful. About 250000 American troops served during the course of the war, with 60000-90000 at once. That's small by modern wars, but not very small. Especially as they did not beat the British. They drove the British away, but they didn't conquer Britain or cause it to collapse. They couldn't even take Canada from them despite trying. The reason for their win was that they had resources where the British by and large lacked them. The Americans could operate using local troops and resources, whereas the British had to ferry all their troops over the Atlantic and buy or take resources from Americans who already had them. And let's not forget that French assistance was required to complete the victory.
In comparison, a Mars trip has all of these reversed. If countries on Earth wish to impose their will on Martian societies, they won't have to do it by sending troops over. The easiest way is to stop sending stuff over. It's much easier for someone on their own to survive on Earth than on Mars, and stuff breaks.
But let's say this is correct. How does it change how a Martian constitution should work? I find the concept annoying not because I think Mars shouldn't have one, but I think that, if they're going to have one, it should be written by people who established a society and wish to remain on Mars. Not by some random company which builds vehicles. It's like saying that the U.S. Constitution should have been written by shipwrights in Europe who would eventually bring people over, for the moment ignoring the native population of the Americas because everyone at the time did. They have no right to assert sovereignty.
"it should be written by people who established a society and wish to remain on Mars"
Exactly this. There should be some Earthian rules that apply to going to Mars and exploiting resources on the planet during these explorations, as well as sorting out what happens when there's a punch up between rival rovers.
But the moment Mars can be considered as being colonised (as in, people there who wish to stay), it is they who should decide what sort of legal framework and constitution should apply, without interference from Earth (either by government or by corporations).
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