back to article USA adds China’s top chipmaker to list of companies American money can’t legally buy a slice of

The US government's Department of Defense has added China’s top chipmaker, Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corp (SMIC) to the list of “Communist Chinese military companies” in which US investors are not permitted to hold or trade shares. The Pentagon’s announcement states it is “determined to highlight and counter …

  1. amanfromMars 1 Silver badge

    The Law of Unintended Consequences Delivering Karma as Shit Happens to the Thoroughly Deserving

    Investors sent SMIC shares down 2.5 percent.

    Clearly they were not investors .... and easily led by chicken feed to feast elsewhere on incestuous home grown fare, a designedly ignominious ware?

    Just imagine anyone in a free world telling you not to make money with your own money with an investment/punt on a sure fire bet? Well, for one thing, it surely wouldn't be anything you would find in a free world, is it, therefore is one sought and thought to be held captive in a rogue state there?

    1. KittenHuffer Silver badge

      Re: The Law of Unintended Consequences Delivering Karma as Shit Happens to the Thoroughly Deserving

      Who are you? And what have you done with amanfromMars?

      Cos I read that and it pretty much made sense, and then I realised who posted it and was a little surprised.

      1. DS999 Silver badge
        Terminator

        Re: The Law of Unintended Consequences Delivering Karma as Shit Happens to the Thoroughly Deserving

        I guess you missed that its AI was upgraded with a more advanced version around the time the pandemic began (insert your own conspiracy theory here)

      2. amanfromMars 1 Silver badge

        What also may surprise you ......

        Who are you? And what have you done with amanfromMars?

        Cos I read that and it pretty much made sense, and then I realised who posted it and was a little surprised. ..... KittenHuffer

        What I have so oft found, and would therefore adjudge it to not be just coincidental, KittenHuffer, is if one travels back in time to something you formerly read and initially dismissed as making no sense, can its subsequent re-readings shed a vast bright light on a whole host of novel matters that you can now recognise as possible, and even also probably current fodder feeding the masses, if not just now simply preparing them for future revelations of the consequences of the information so freely formerly shared and not initially understood or misunderstood.

        And such a simple pastime works wonderfully well for oneself, re that which one may have formerly written and shared oneself, especially whenever everything posited then can be so easily confirmed and accepted as valid and true nowadays, and be increasingly agreed upon to be so by others too. As a quite remarkable and extremely simple self-help therapy, it has no peers.

        Thus is one never left alone in the results of one's thoughts ..... which all too often can tip and trip one over into the welcoming fields of madness and mayhem, conflict and bedlam and CHAOS. :-)

    2. Chris G Silver badge

      Re: The Law of Unintended Consequences Delivering Karma as Shit Happens to the Thoroughly Deserving

      It's just one more instance of the US telling another sovereign state ' Don't do as we do, do as we say.'

      Less of a world policeman, more of a world bully.

      1. sabroni Silver badge

        Re: more of a world bully.

        Fuck Yeah!

        1. Inkey
          Gimp

          Re: more of a world bully.

          And complete and utter whores for profit

  2. Oh Homer
    FAIL

    Here we go again...

    The Yanks desperately trying to shore up their failing economy using a hopeless strategy, under the guise of "national security".

    If it really wants to be competitive, maybe it could try, erm, you know, actually making stuff, without gouging customers.

    But nope, clearly it's easier to run a protection racket than reopen factories.

    Make America Broke Again!

    1. HildyJ Silver badge
      Devil

      Re: Here we go again...

      That used to be the British Empire's job.

  3. Adelio Silver badge

    I am starting to think that I need to try and avoid bying anything chinese.

    The way China is behaving in HongKong and just their general attitude made me less and less able to justify aiding that country by buying it's products.

    I would be great if Amazon and other companies listed the country of manufacture of all items, ideally allow you to exclude that country (or list of countries) when searching for items

    1. Alumoi Silver badge

      So you will stop buying clothes, shoes, any kind of (electronic) appliance and tools.

      Better start learning how to live in a cave and grow your own food, in a couple of years everything will be 'made in China, designed in the US/UE'

    2. heyrick Silver badge

      "I am starting to think that I need to try and avoid bying anything chinese."

      This ridiculous pantomime glosses over the fact that China is the world's warehouse. Most of the PPE doing the rounds, all the fruity shininess, actually most things with a plug attached, a lot of clothing that isn't from Bangladesh...

      Good luck avoiding "Made in China", and to be honest, can we say that America is actually any better?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Just because its hard to do, doesn't mean it isn't worth doing. And every penny that goes to China supports the CCP's violation of basic human rights.

        1. heyrick Silver badge

          Yes, AC, but the point is that if you buy American or British or whatever, there's a pretty good chance that they are sending the pennies to China on your behalf. Hence the great difficulty in actually avoiding stuff "made in China".

    3. DS999 Silver badge

      They could easily game that

      What's the country of manufacture if a PC's motherboard, power supply, SSD, keyboard, mouse and monitor are all made in China, and shipped to the US where they are placed inside a plastic case made in China? Anyone wanna bet against Amazon putting a little US flag next to that and claim "made in the USA"?

      If you think that's too extreme, what if the case, keyboard, mouse and power supply are made in Vietnam - even if you decide slapping parts in a case doesn't make it "made in the USA" is that no longer "made in China"? If not, what is the country of manufacture? If you want to split that up by percentage, is it done by volume, weight, or value? If the latter, is the value wholesale or retail? What value do you assign to software that probably made in the US, or if not in India? How about the value of the IP that made that hardware possible?

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Writing as a British Tory poster my country would do well to cement a favourable trade relationship with the PRC perhaps over a Biden administrated USA.

      If that Irish American semi senile "Gentleman" wants to tear up that faint shadow of a "Special Relationship" that existed between our nations a move towards trading with an Eastern trading group makes solid sense.

      Boris take note!

  4. Andy The Hat Silver badge

    Echo from the past ...?

    "... Threat from Securities Investments that Finance Communist Chinese Military Companies "

    Not "the Chinese", not even "the People's Republic of China" but an Executive Order using the wholly incitive phrase "the Communist Chinese". I have heard McCarthy's lawyers are sueing for breach of copyright ...

    At least we can rest in our beds knowing that the US Anti-Communist military can't get it's similarly mucky paws on equipment from Intel or AMD or IBM or Microsoft or Amazon ... or get funding from the state ...

    1. Jimmy2Cows Silver badge

      Re: Echo from the past ...?

      Yeah, this is just yet another example of some Yanks complaining about a different country doing exactly with they (Yanks) do.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      WTF?

      Re: Echo from the past ...?

      "the Communist Chinese".

      I am really struggling with the concept of being able to buy, sell or even own company stock in a "communist state".

      The concept at the very core of communism is the common ownership by the "workers" of the means of production - i.e. corporations and their assets. So, there is no question of a commercial market in corporate stock. In fact, what we have here is exactly Karl Marx's definition of capitalism - "a mode of production based on private ownership of the means of production."

      Describing modern China as "communist" (and its ruling party calling itself a communist party) is just absurd.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Echo from the past ...?

        To be fair they think us Brits are commies, because we have a health service. We did abolish free tertiary education in order to free up some funds for baby boomers but apparently that's not enough.

  5. PhilipN Silver badge

    Ho-hum

    Given a choice between US shareholders and continuing to poach engineers from TSMC - no contest.

    Except now there are plenty of competitors emerging inside China for the same talent pool.

  6. Pascal Monett Silver badge

    "SMIC’s foundries are now capable of producing 14nm devices"

    Um, technology is now at 5nm.

    You need to catch up.

    1. genghis_uk Silver badge

      Re: "SMIC’s foundries are now capable of producing 14nm devices"

      Bleeding edge technology may be at 5nm but a vast majority of devices are not.

      Sub 10nm process accounts for less than 10% of global wafer capacity (source: IC Insights) so they are not badly placed in the overall field.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: "SMIC’s foundries are now capable of producing 14nm devices"

      @Pascal Monett

      Quote "Um, technology is now at 5nm. You need to catch up" unquote.

      Maybe you should pass that message to Intel?

      Cheers.. Ishy

  7. martinusher Silver badge

    ..and the purppose of investing is?

    The official reason for shares and stuff like that is to raise capital for a business. I don't think SMIC is hurting for capital investment at the moment so whether or not US investors are allowed to put money in is irrelevant from a Chinese perspective. (Not from a US perspective -- this could be a good company to invest in medium to long term, politics permitting.)

    The Chinese government has been gratually reducing its stock of US Treasuraries this year. Nothing rapid that's likely to spook the markets, just a steady trickle.

  8. Claverhouse Silver badge
    Holmes

    Including Just The Right Amount Of Implicit Self-Pity...

    Executive Order on Addressing the Threat from Securities Investments that Finance Communist Chinese Military Companies

    Snappy...

  9. Blackjack Silver badge

    Canada, eh?

    Does Canada have the same rules? Because for some companies, maybe they could just... move to another country.

    If the USA don't wanna buy their things cause parts of them are made in China? Too bad, there are other countries to sell stuff to.

  10. cornetman Silver badge

    After watching Yuri Bezmenov's lecture for the third time:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FElIhOh_KI

    ...and seeing the weird shit going on in the US (the self loathing, the taking over of city centres by gangs of revolutionaries and criminals. the indoctrination of our youth to despise the "system" and society in general, the demonisation of the police), it is hard to not conclude that there is something in what he says.

    The thing is, what the US administration is doing would be a lot easier to swallow if it wasn't being instrumented by the moronic buffoon that is about to be kicked out of the White House. Even some small evidence to at least justify these actions would be helpful. Perhaps they don't have anything concrete, but know that *something* has to be done to reduce the west's dependence on China, or to kill their influence in western life. I dunno.

    I find myself more often than not defending these companies against what seems to be rather baseless and unfair treatment at the hands of the US government. Perhaps, however, these companies are merely pawns in a global political conflict that is barely visible to us. Or perhaps Trump is just a complete tool. Or maybe both.

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